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Author Topic: ASC 2.0 Space Marines  (Read 8233 times)

Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« on: June 15, 2013, 07:37:54 AM »
Continuing with the  Additional Ship's Compendium 2.0 we are moning onto the Space Marine Fleet list.
See the full list of ASC ships below:
http://www.forum.specialist-arms.com/index.php?topic=5479.0

This topic is specifically for the development of the SM ships on that list for use in BFG:R. Please give feed back (or provide new/alternative profiles yourself!)

Note, even though ASC 2.0 is going to pretty much allow whatever sort of ship selection people want (since they are already unnofficial ships) it will include some basic guidelines for how the ships should be intergrated into lists. Many Space Marine vessels have further guidelines beyond this even, and any such restrictions will be in the vessel's special rules.

Where I change items, I will either note it in design notes or put the orignal in paranthesis.

I'm going to kick it off with the Venerable Battlebarges (and include the Space Wolf ones likely tomorrow, after I get a little more feed back in another thread):

Ragnarok Class Assault Battle Barge- 465
Hits: 12
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Sheilds: 4
Armour: 6+
Turrets:  4
Weapons
Prow Bombardment Cannons: R: 30cm S: 6 Arc: L/F/R
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons: R: 30cm S: 8 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 3 squadrons Arc: -
Port Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Special Rules: Cannot use come to new heading. Takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge is a Space Marine and Space Wolves fleet.
Design Notes- I think I only changed the points cost from what was in WR 13.

Vindictive Class Grand Cruiser- 325 (SPACE MARINE OR CHAOS FLEETS)
Hits: 10
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Sheilds: 3
Armour: 5+
Turrets:  3
Weapons
Dorsal Bombardment Cannon: R: 30cm S: 4 Arc: L/F/R
Port Bombardment Cannon: R: 30cm S: 2 Arc: L
Stbd Bombardment Cannon: R: 30cm S: 2 Arc: R
Dorsal Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 1 squadron Arc: -
Port Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Special Rules: Space Marine Crew. Takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge in a Space Marine fleet.
Design Notes- Based off the Iron Wolf in WR13. I changed the Lances to Bombardment Cannons to better reflect the Space Marines. The original image had 4 hardpoints with LBs, which didn't make sense with p/s lances (now BCannons), nor with only S2 squadrons per side. So the idea is the P/S LBs are the lower hard points and the upper hard points are the Dorsal LBs. Only 1 upper hard point would be LBs and the other would be BCannons (instead of all Hard Points being LBs).


Charybdis Class Grand Cruiser- 330 (305) (SPACE MARINE OR CHAOS FLEETS)
Hits: 10
Speed: 20 cm (25cm)
Turns: 45*
Shields:  3 (5)
Armour: 6+
Turrets:  3
Weapons
Port Weap Batteries- R: 45cm S: 8 (7) Arc: L
Stbd Weap Batteries- R: 45cm S: 8 (7) Arc: R
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons- R: 30cm S: 6 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Under Prow Plasma Destructor- R: 15cm S:10 Arc: F
Special Rules: Space Marine Crew. Takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge in a Space Marine fleet.
Plasma Destructor: Always hit on a 5+. Always inflicts critical hits on a 5+. When checking for crits, plasma destructor hits receive a +1 bonus.
Design Notes- Based off the Nicor from IA vol 10. The intention is to use the Grim Dark Bits Heresy Era BB as the model for this ship. I didn't like the Prow Torpedoes on The Nicor, so I changed them to Dorsal Bombardment Cannons to better fit SM, and they make more sense with the intended model.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2013, 06:17:48 PM by Gothmog Lord of Balrogs »
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Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2013, 12:58:37 PM »
Well, all of the broadsides seem really under gunned for the grand cruisers. I like the idea of tying the GDB barge to a rule set too, its a great looking model.
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.

Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2013, 03:42:41 PM »
Vindictive Class Grand Cruiser- 330 (SPACE MARINE OR CHAOS FLEETS)
Hits: 10
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Shields:  3
Armour: 6+
Turrets:  3
Weapons
Port LBs- Thunderhawks- Speed: 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd LBs- Thunderhawks- Speed: 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons- R: 30cm S: 6 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Under Prow Plasma Destructor- R: 15cm S:10 Arc: F
Special Rules: Space Marine Crew. Takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge in a Space Marine fleet.
Plasma Destructor: Always hit on a 5+. Always inflicts critical hits on a 5+. When checking for crits, plasma destructor hits receive a +1 bonus.
Design notes: I really didn't like the last Vindictive, and chances are no one would model it. SO I went with this instead. Uses the GDB Heresy Era BB just like the Charybdis, but requires some slight conversion work removing/covering the WBs and adding LBs
« Last Edit: June 15, 2013, 06:18:20 PM by Gothmog Lord of Balrogs »
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2013, 03:45:36 PM »
Well, all of the broadsides seem really under gunned for the grand cruisers. I like the idea of tying the GDB barge to a rule set too, its a great looking model.

It seems that way to me too, but I am looking at the SM BB, which only has S12 45cm WB and costs 440 pts in BFGR
SO for 110 pts less you loose (on the charybdis) 2 hits, 1 shield, 1 turret, S4 Broadsides each side, 1 squadron TH, S2 Dorsal BCannons and swap torps for the plasma destructor.
That might be a little too much to chop away. Maybe up the WB to S10?
Remember that SM launch bays are essentially suppossed to be 1/2 of the imperial equivalens (so a S2 SM LB is like an S4 IN LB) and from what I can tell BCannons are 2 x Lances (so S3 lances is S6 BCannons). As well, they both now have 6+ armour on all facings and SM crew.

On another similar note, should the Assault BB be S3 TH a side?
« Last Edit: June 15, 2013, 04:04:14 PM by Gothmog Lord of Balrogs »
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Offline afterimagedan

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2013, 08:24:43 PM »
The Tyranid Hive ship is called Charybdis now so maybe a different name?

Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2013, 01:45:52 AM »
The Tyranid Hive ship is called Charybdis now so maybe a different name?

The only issue is in IA vol 10, the Nicor is said to be a Charybdis Class Grand Cruiser...

BUT maybe something else would still be better. I'll think on it and propose a few names.
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2013, 02:11:18 AM »
So no other feedback on the ships above? Should I up the WB S on the Charybdis (new name TBD?)

So here are some Space Wolves specific character ships

Pride of Fenris- Space Wolves Retribution Class Battleship- 610
Hits: 12
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Sheilds: 4
Armour: 5+/6+ Front
Turrets:  4
Weapons
Port Weap Battery- R: 45cm  S: 18 Arc: L
Stbd Weap Battery-  R: 45cm S: 18 Arc: R
Dorsal Lance Battery- R: 60cm S: 3 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Special Rules:  Cannot use come to new heading. Space Marine Crew. The Pride of Fenris takes the place of a Venerable Battlebarge in a Space Wolves fleet.
Logan Grimnar- LD 10, 4 Rerolls. Logan Grimnar’s Wolf Guard Terminators- Hit and Run Attack that may roll 3d6 and apply 2 of the results (Space Marine Player’s Choice). This is in addition to a normal Hit and Run attack.
Design Notes: EXPENSIVE. Let me break it down. 355 base. +10 points in swapping torps for TH as part of that "unique" factor = 365. +35 points SM crew = 400. +50 LD 10 = 450. +4 rerolls @ 25pts ea = 550. +50 pts Terminator Boarding Party = 600. +10 pts Wolf Guard bump (3 d6, choose 2 instead of just 2d6 apply both) = 610. Figured the best way to make it a character ship was to actually put a Character on it.

Retribution- Space Wolves Emperor Class Battleship- 430
Hits: 12
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Sheilds: 4
Armour: 5+
Turrets:  5
Weapons
Port Weap Battery- R: 60cm  S: 6 Arc: L
Stbd Weap Battery-  R: 60cm S: 6 Arc: R
Dorsal Weap Battery- R: 60cm S: 5 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Weap Battery- R: 60cm S: 5 Arc: L/F/R
Port Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Special Rules:  Cannot use come to new heading. +1 LD. Space Marine Crew.
Bran Redmaw’s Wolf Guard- The vessel may make 2 Hit and Run Attacks, both of which roll 2d6 and choose the result. The Retribution takes the place of a Venerable Battlebarge in a Space Wolves fleet.
Design notes- SO this time it is an Emperor, 365 base. +35 points SM crew = 400. +10 points 5cm speed = 410. +10 point for Honour Guard = 420. +10 points for Wolf Guard bump (Honour Guard rules apply to both hit and run attacks).
Should the speed bonus only be +5 points?

Iron Wolf- Space Wolves Vindictive Class Grand Cruiser- 350
Hits: 10
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Shields:  3
Armour: 6+
Turrets:  3
Weapons
Port LBs- Thunderhawks- Speed: 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd LBs- Thunderhawks- Speed: 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons- R: 30cm S: 6 Arc: L/F/R
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -
Under Prow Plasma Destructor- R: 15cm S:10 Arc: F
Special Rules: Space Marine Crew. Takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge in a Space Wolves fleet.
Plasma Destructor- Always hit on a 5+. When checking for crits, plasma destructor hits receive a +1 bonus.
Egil Iron Wolf’s Wolf Guard- The vessel may make 2 Hit and Run Attacks, both of which roll 2d6 and choose the result. The Iron Wolf takes the place of a Venerable Battle Barge in a Space Wolves fleet.
Design Notes- Same as the Vindictive Class Grand Cruiser plus the same Wolf Guard rules as the Retribution.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2013, 02:22:46 AM by Gothmog Lord of Balrogs »
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2013, 04:57:52 AM »
The Tyranid Hive ship is called Charybdis now so maybe a different name?

What about implacable?


Sorry I haven't had any new ships up. Been super busy. Tomorrow or wednesday.
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Offline FistusMaximus

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2013, 07:16:20 PM »
On another similar note, should the Assault BB be S3 TH a side?

i'd say yes, but maybe vote?

and by the way, why does it swap the torps for a BB cannon, its not supposed to be a ship of the first line, its more a carrier....  so why that?
Nova Cannons are for these sissies who as a kid too preferred to throw stones at the others from a safe distance rather than closing in and get into a real fight ;D

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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2013, 08:54:25 PM »
3 a side may be a little much considering the normal BB is just S12 45cm batteries, which would be equivalent to only 2 hardpoints on an IN ship. 2 Hardpoints would give S4 LBs on IN, and the rule of thumb for SM LBs is to halve the S for TH.

The reason for the switch is because it isn't a ship of the line. Bombardment Cannons are what SM use to pound the ground to dust from orbit. This is an assault BB, not a support BB. It is meant to get in close to a planet, space station or another vessel and launch waves of thunderhawks to bring the fight to the enemy.
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2013, 09:00:23 PM »
Dire Wolf Assault Strike Cruiser- 155
Hits: 6
Speed: 25 cm
Turns: 90*
Shields:  1
Armour: 6+
Turrets:  2
Weapons
Prow Bombardment Cannons- R: 30cm S: 3 Arc: L/F/R
Port Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 1 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 1 squadrons Arc: -
Prow Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 2 squadrons Arc: -


Fist of Russ- Space Wolves Mars Class Battlecruiser- 320
Hits: 8
Speed: 20 cm
Turns: 45*
Shields:  2
Armour: 5+/6+ Front
Turrets:  3
Weapons
Prow Nova Cannon- R: 30-150cm S: 1 Arc: F
Port Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 1 squadrons Arc: -
Stbd Launch Bays- Thunderhawks- Speed 20cm S: 1 squadrons Arc: -
Port Weap Batteries- R: 45cm S: 6 Arc: L
Stbd Weap Batteries- R: 45cm S: 6 Arc: R
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons- R: 30cm S: 4 Arc: L/F/R
Special Rules: Space Marine Crew. Left Column Shift.
Design Notes- Basically a mars class with the +1 Turret and Left Col Shift (figured SM would have good tech to upgrade it with). As well, swapped the lances for bombardment cannons, just to give it more of that SM feel. Seems like something that SM would very likely do to captured vessel.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2013, 03:39:06 PM by Gothmog Lord of Balrogs »
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Offline FistusMaximus

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2013, 10:33:44 PM »
putting the assault strike cruiser at 155 for space wolves would make it 10 points cheaper than if other SM chapters would take one (which would be 165), is that intentional?
Nova Cannons are for these sissies who as a kid too preferred to throw stones at the others from a safe distance rather than closing in and get into a real fight ;D

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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2013, 02:15:07 AM »
putting the assault strike cruiser at 155 for space wolves would make it 10 points cheaper than if other SM chapters would take one (which would be 165), is that intentional?

BFGR Strike cruisers are 145 points, so this is 10 points more expensive actually...
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Offline FistusMaximus

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2013, 11:27:59 AM »
putting the assault strike cruiser at 155 for space wolves would make it 10 points cheaper than if other SM chapters would take one (which would be 165), is that intentional?

BFGR Strike cruisers are 145 points, so this is 10 points more expensive actually...

not with the side TH launch bay swap which i was talking about, that was +10 points per side for regular SM iirc....  makes total 165, 10 points more than the SW assault SC....
Nova Cannons are for these sissies who as a kid too preferred to throw stones at the others from a safe distance rather than closing in and get into a real fight ;D

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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: ASC 2.0 Space Marines
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2013, 01:19:38 PM »
putting the assault strike cruiser at 155 for space wolves would make it 10 points cheaper than if other SM chapters would take one (which would be 165), is that intentional?

BFGR Strike cruisers are 145 points, so this is 10 points more expensive actually...

not with the side TH launch bay swap which i was talking about, that was +10 points per side for regular SM iirc....  makes total 165, 10 points more than the SW assault SC....

I missed the replace WBs line somehow. Crazy. It is +15 points. Which makes this way cheaper and pointless.

I'll probably just remove the Direwolf since the normal SC can fill the same role
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