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Author Topic: BFG:R Daemon Ships  (Read 26605 times)

Offline Sigoroth

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2013, 07:42:06 PM »
Strangely, though, FAQ2010 wouldn't allow a spectral Daemon to move...

Not strange at all. Combine the effects of a spectral Daemonship with the Mark of Slaanesh and the ability to dog the enemy and you get "not fun at all".

Offline Brethren

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2013, 08:12:30 PM »
Strangely, though, FAQ2010 wouldn't allow a spectral Daemon to move...
Not strange at all. Combine the effects of a spectral Daemonship with the Mark of Slaanesh and the ability to dog the enemy and you get "not fun at all".
True.
So it certainly should come down to...
- no move while spectral or
- no effect for marks while spectral.

It seems to me like allowing the enemy first crack at the daemon ship is the entire problem. That makes it not worth it for me. I am going to try to daemon bomb the enemy, but they may just cripple/destroy it before it does anything. That is too much of a risk, especially for something that also may scatter. If the chaos vessel takes control first, the enemy can at least try to get a favorable position before the next turn, or just fly away from it.
I know what you mean. But I think of that just as a matter of deployment.
- place Daemon 20cm (Armada/FAQ rules) behind the last enemy vessel
- the enemy drifts at least 10cm further (if not on special orders)
How many ships out there have a considerable firepower over 30cm? Noted, against Eldar or Necrons this won't work. On its own turn the Daemon can bring out his long range firepower.

I've got a compromise to your suggestion, though. If "becoming solid" would be considered a "move special order", thus halving weaponry on that turn, I could go with the Daemon bomb.

P.S.: One of our 'new' Relictor battleships daemon bombing a fleet with full weapon power at close range just gave me a shiver.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2013, 08:14:39 PM by Brethren »

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2013, 08:17:40 PM »
I think no marks while spectral and weapons on half effect the turn chaos takes control. How about that?
« Last Edit: April 01, 2013, 02:33:01 AM by afterimagedan »

Offline Neferhet

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2013, 10:14:58 AM »
seems a good compromise. If the limitation 1/1000 stays, you could allow some more "initiative" to the ship. Maybe mark could be effective? We are talking about the slaanesh mark, of course. 15cm are easy to avoid, after all. This way Chaos fleet could have a great way, yet extremely limited and prone to retaliation, to broke an enemy formation.
In the end how it should work then?
Summary of the current iteration please :)

Offline Brethren

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2013, 10:42:23 PM »
I'd prefer spectral movement over spectral marks. The latter only works with the Mark of Slaanesh. Movement on the other hand helps to correct unlucky scatter rolls.

Summary:

  • Availiability:
    • A Daemon Ship is an upgrade on any capital ship availiable to a chaos fleet (with the exception of unique ships) that can be taken once every 1000pts.

  • Upgrade cost:
    • Battleship:          +40pts
    • Grand Cruiser:   +30pts
    • Heavy Cruiser:   +25pts
    • Cruiser:               +20pts
    • Light Cruiser:     +15pts

  • Special Rules:
    • General:
      • A Daemon cannot take a Commander or Chaos Space Marines, even if it is the biggest ship in the fleet..
      • It can be equipped with one Mark of Chaos.
      • A Daemon gets a boarding modifier of +1 due to its unnatural "crew" and "interior environment".
      • The Daemon's weapons follow the normal rules of weapons according to its ship class, even if these weapons are in fact something else entirely.

    • Deployment:
      • May be kept of the table at normal deployment to be summoned later.
      • In any chaos end phase, pick one capital ship and position the Daemon within 20cm to it.
        Then roll a scatter die and 4D6 to see where the Daemon actually turnes up, facing a direction of the chaos player's choosing. At this point the Daemon is considered spectral.

    • Spectral:
      • A spectral Daemon moves normal according to the rules, but is not affected by obstacles like terrain or mines.
      • All ships within 15cm of a spectral Daemon get -1Ld.
      • A spectral Daemon may do nothing, except moving and becoming solid. It can't be targeted or harmed in return. In addition Chaos Marks that would affect other ships on the battlefield don't do so while the Daemon is spectral.
      • "Special Order: Become solid". At the beginning of the chaos players phase the Daemon can be given the special order to become solid to act as a normal ships can. Roll a leadership test to see if the Daemon managed the transition. Just roll once for squadrons of Daemons. "Become solid" halves the ships firepower on that turn. If successful the Daemon becomes solid and may act as a normal ship from now on.
        As usual the Daemon gets +1Ld if an enemy ship is on special orders this turn.

    • Haunting:
      • At the beginning of the chaos player's phase a Daemon can disengage without taking a leadership test. The Daemon is considered to be back in the Warp. Simply remove it from the rable.
      • Lurking in the Warp a Daemon can repair critical damage normally. Additionally it can enter the game again using the same rules as listed in "Deployment".
      • When the Daemon returns to the table roll a D6.
        • 1,2: nothing happens
        • 3,4: the Daemon regains 1 hit
        • 5,6: the Daemon regains 2 hits
        • add +1 to the roll for every turn the Daemon spent in the Warp after the first. The Daemon cannot get more hitpoints than a ship of its class would normally have.
      • The Daemon is still considered "disengaged" for the purposes of victory points.



Puah. Large posts like this are exhausting to glue together if you don't want to forget something. :)

This is basically a "kit bash" of Armada, FAQ2010, Plaxors BFG:R and our ideas. Since the Daemons seem to draw considerably less attention than other stuff I hope this kind of gets it done.
Feel free to comment.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2013, 10:58:18 PM by Brethren »

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #20 on: April 06, 2013, 06:52:13 AM »
I love it. It's only slightly different than the normal version but I think the small changes make it much better. I think the buffed Haunting rules make it more useful and the point costs are much more reasonable. I think we should vote to implement these.

Offline Neferhet

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Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
« Reply #21 on: April 06, 2013, 10:53:53 AM »
    I'd prefer spectral movement over spectral marks. The latter only works with the Mark of Slaanesh. Movement on the other hand helps to correct unlucky scatter rolls.

    I guess you are right.  Agreed.

    Summary:

    • Availiability:
      • A Daemon Ship is an upgrade on any capital ship availiable to a chaos fleet (with the exception of unique ships) that can be taken once every 1000pts.

    • Upgrade cost:
      • Battleship:          +40pts
      • Grand Cruiser:   +30pts
      • Heavy Cruiser:   +25pts
      • Cruiser:               +20pts
      • Light Cruiser:     +15pts

    • Special Rules:
      • General:
        • A Daemon cannot take a Commander or Chaos Space Marines, even if it is the biggest ship in the fleet..
        • It can be equipped with one Mark of Chaos.
        • A Daemon gets a boarding modifier of +1 due to its unnatural "crew" and "interior environment".
        This, i imagine, is in addition to the Chaos +1 ?
        • The Daemon's weapons follow the normal rules of weapons according to its ship class, even if these weapons are in fact something else entirely.

      • Deployment:
        • May be kept of the table at normal deployment to be summoned later.
        • In any chaos end phase, pick one capital ship and position the Daemon within 20cm to it.
          Then roll a scatter die and 4D6 to see where the Daemon actually turnes up, facing a direction of the chaos player's choosing. At this point the Daemon is considered spectral.
        If I may, I'd give ships with the same mark an advantage.  So if a DShip has a mark, it will not scatter if appearing within 20 cm of a ship with the same mark.
    • Spectral:
      • A spectral Daemon moves normal according to the rules, but is not affected by obstacles like terrain or mines.
      • All ships within 15cm of a spectral Daemon get -1Ld.
      • A spectral Daemon may do nothing, except moving and becoming solid. It can't be targeted or harmed in return. In addition Chaos Marks that would affect other ships on the battlefield don't do so while the Daemon is spectral.
      • "Special Order: Become solid". At the beginning of the chaos players phase the Daemon can be given the special order to become solid to act as a normal ships can. Roll a leadership test to see if the Daemon managed the transition. Just roll once for squadrons of Daemons. "Become solid" halves the ships firepower on that turn. If successful the Daemon becomes solid and may act as a normal ship from now on.
        As usual the Daemon gets +1Ld if an enemy ship is on special orders this turn.
      This is not so appealing. Nice, but dangerous for the Chaos player. I pay points for a ship that can be useless for 2+ turns, if just a single wrong dice roll occurs. You cannot even have a commander on the ship to boost morale. There is also a not so small chance that you will get Ld 6 DShips. Good luck becoming real!
    [/li]
    [li]Haunting:
    • At the beginning of the chaos player's phase a Daemon can disengage without taking a leadership test. The Daemon is considered to be back in the Warp. Simply remove it from the table.
    • Lurking in the Warp a Daemon can repair critical damage normally. Additionally it can enter the game again using the same rules as listed in "Deployment".
    • When the Daemon returns to the table roll a D6.
      • 1,2: nothing happens
      • 3,4: the Daemon regains 1 hit
      • 5,6: the Daemon regains 2 hits
      • add +1 to the roll for every turn the Daemon spent in the Warp after the first. The Daemon cannot get more hitpoints than a ship of its class would normally have.
    • The Daemon is still considered "disengaged" for the purposes of victory points.
    So, if I just want to give away free Victory points, I'll just take a Dship. This, imho, must go. We could say that, at the end of the game, if itìs still in he warp, it counts as disengaged.
    [/li]
    [/list]

    [/li]
    [/list]


    Puah. Large posts like this are exhausting to glue together if you don't want to forget something. :)

    This is basically a "kit bash" of Armada, FAQ2010, Plaxors BFG:R and our ideas. Since the Daemons seem to draw considerably less attention than other stuff I hope this kind of gets it done.
    Feel free to comment.

    It's really a good "kitbash" as you call it :)
    There are many good points.
    I'm sorry to be so annoying, but if we really aim to make DShips viable, we must give them some appeal. Since those are even limited we can add something useful. Like NOT halving the firepower in the turn they become solid. That would be nasty.

    Besides, here is a simple scenario to better understand my point:
    let's pretend a IN fleet clashes with a Chaos fleet. 
    IN has the first turn.

    In the End phase of Chaos first turn the ships "haunts" an enemy ship of the same tonnage (say a Cruiser).
    In the second turn the IN ship moves away an avarage 20 cm (or 36 cm avarage, if All ahead full was used).

    The Dship tries to become solid. Chanches are (with an avarage ld 7+1 Ld if IN has Special Orders) 66,666 % of positive outcome. Then, we will have (pratically) a crippled ship firing a no longer so near target, probably surrounded by enemies and far from our fleet.
    Next turn the Dship soak a lot of short ranged firepower and is statistically forced to disengage in the warp, thus becoming useless for 2 turns more and conceding the enemy victory points!!
    So, my point is: why pay more for a ship that has his main utility "behind enemy lines" but cannot punch hard enough when appearing and is realistically unable to survive retaliation without being useless for almost half the game?
    Sorry again  :P

    EDIT: I know, some post before this I agreed with halving the firepower whee becoming real. But it's really an handicap. I've made some mathcrunching, and there's really a small chanche to actually hurt something with half firepower, even with a  battleship.
    I just want some more love for the DShips!! :D
    « Last Edit: April 06, 2013, 11:03:33 AM by Neferhet »

    Offline horizon

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #22 on: April 06, 2013, 12:19:05 PM »
    Actually the Daemonship can move after being solid, thus it can close the 36cm gap again.

    Pretty good work by the way Brethren.

    As for Neferhet's mark idea and not scattering: this is an added rule, needing more lines to explain. I wouldn't do it. If they're in squadron they use 1 dice roll. But not in a squadron, even with same mark. Just to keep it more streamlined regarding rule writing.

    Counting a daemonship in the warp when the games ends as disengaged for VPS is good.

    As for becoming spectral on a Ld roll: yes, Ld6 will hurt. Perhaps just a D6 roll: on a 1 it fails, on 2-6 it works?

    Offline Brethren

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #23 on: April 06, 2013, 01:03:45 PM »
    Thank you guys. I'm happy to provide something useful. :)

    I love it. It's only slightly different than the normal version but I think the small changes make it much better. I think the buffed Haunting rules make it more useful and the point costs are much more reasonable. I think we should vote to implement these.
    Actually that's Plaxor's approach. I compared BFG:R to FAQ/Armada and picked the more favorable rules.

    As for becoming spectral on a Ld roll: yes, Ld6 will hurt. Perhaps just a D6 roll: on a 1 it fails, on 2-6 it works?
    That's the Armada way. :)

    But you're right. May be the Special Order is a bit harsh. How about we alter the rule to:
    - Daemon gets solid anyway
    - Daemon gets full firepower on successful Ld-roll / half firepower if not successful

    The main ideas behind the "special order" thing are, keeping the Daemons rules close to the normal rules... and preventing the Daemon from getting another special order on the arriving turn. (I.e. Lock-on with a Daemon bombing battleship)

    - A Daemon gets a boarding modifier of +1 due to its unnatural "crew" and "interior environment".
    This, i imagine, is in addition to the Chaos +1 ?
    That was the idea.

    In any chaos end phase, pick one capital ship and position the Daemon within 20cm to it.
    Then roll a scatter die and 4D6 to see where the Daemon actually turnes up, facing a direction of the chaos player's choosing. At this point the Daemon is considered spectral.
    If I may, I'd give ships with the same mark an advantage.  So if a DShip has a mark, it will not scatter if appearing within 20 cm of a ship with the same mark.
    A good though in general, but like horizon I think that addition is not necessary. If you drop the Daemon to your own fleet there's more room for "failure". 4D6 average on a 14cm... that's not really far from where you wanted it anyway. (Plus, if two Chaos fleets battle, this could become confusing. ;) )


    The Daemon is still considered "disengaged" for the purposes of victory points.
    So, if I just want to give away free Victory points, I'll just take a Dship. This, imho, must go. We could say that, at the end of the game, if itìs still in he warp, it counts as disengaged.
    The Daemon is considered "disengaged" for the purposes of victory points if the game ends and the Daemon is still in the Warp.
    I'm fine with that. :)


    I'd like to point out that the "summoning (end phase), becoming solid (movemend phase)"-version has another really nasty tweak if you think about it... faster re-appearing.
    - turn 1 /end phase: summon as spectral
    - turn 2 /movement: become solid, move and fire
                  /enemy: be shot at, go on BFI
    - turn 3 /movement: drop back to the warp
                  /end phase: summon as spectral, get roll to regain hits
    - turn 4 /movement: become solid... and go again

    This way the Daemon is only out for one round, before it comes into action again. If you had to brace your Daemon you won't get much firepower from it anyway, so just drop out and repair the damage.

    Offline Neferhet

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #24 on: April 06, 2013, 02:53:55 PM »
    Hi brethren :)

    About the +1 on boarding: perfect.

    "- Daemon gets full firepower on successful Ld-roll / half firepower if not successful"

    LOVE this. :-* of course with no kind of rerolls allowed

    "The main ideas behind the "special order" thing are, keeping the Daemons rules close to the normal rules... and preventing the Daemon from getting another special order on the arriving turn. (I.e. Lock-on with a Daemon bombing battleship)"

     We can just clarify this: DShips cannot take special orders the turn they appear.

    About the mark thing, yes, it may be confusing. Let's drop it.

    "summoning (end phase), becoming solid (movemend phase)"
    aw, now I get it. I was stuck tinking you could reappear only in the NEXT end phase. Dunno why. I apologize for not having understood this. This is the kind of love i was looking for DShips.

    Offline afterimagedan

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #25 on: April 06, 2013, 04:18:42 PM »
    I agree with the current trend of the thread but two things I have a hard time with. If we make it 2+ to solidify, we should not allow for a ship to not have half firepower. That would really allow for a Relictorbomb. I say 2+, no special orders, half firepower the turn they arrive. At bare minimum, paying points for the ship to be a daemon ship is basically a way to give a +1 to boarding (which is a hefty cost when other fleets take it) and the ability to appear very close to enemy ships in offer the exact place you want them without being shot up on the way. Halving the firepower the turn it arrives prevents it from being too overpowered. If you Relictorbomb them, they pretty much have to get out of there on their turn, and that's part of the point. However, depending on the fleet and how they choose to move, you may he able to be in close range next turn. So full FP in close range is too much for this.

    I think 2+ to arrive, half FP the turn you arrive+not allowing for a free turn of shooting against you (like then old rules) is a great balance.

    Also, the disengage thing: its only counted as disengaging when you reenter the warp. This his usually when you are in a dangerous place and are going to disengage anyways. This is a boost because you don't have to stay gone; you can heal up and return. I think that's really nice.

    Offline horizon

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #26 on: April 06, 2013, 06:23:56 PM »
    I support  the ld  check  with succeed  is full  firepower, with failed half.

    Offline Neferhet

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #27 on: April 06, 2013, 09:05:49 PM »
    Well, afterimagedan, I'm not certainly going to fight on those  points :D
    Anyway, we are speaking about a limited ship. If you are troubled by the relictormbomb, then I say you are trobled about a 340 point ship in an average 1500 pts fleets. I would be troubled anyway!!
    I fell that if we let things too similar to the current situation, we are not going to improve the DShip. It will just stay on the shelf. For now we just agreed over a limitation and a better entrance system. We barely mitigated its flaws. We need something to make it useful. And just the +1 to boarding is not a real allure, to my eyes.
    About that we can have a little more debating, if you are ok. Maybe we can find an optimal and shared solution.

    But, about the victory points: I would feel really baffled to concede my opponent VP just for using an ability of my ship! You say that if you use the "warp" option, it's mainly because you would have done it anyway to save your Axx, and coming back it's just a bonus. I say, instead, that the "warp" option adds a tactical dimesion to the Dship. I wouldn't use this ability just to escape. I would use it to appear where most needed, cutting line of fire, forcing Ld check to shoot a farther target, to menace the rear of a lonesome ship, to save another ship from incoming ordnance...in short I would use it really often. Knowing that I would concede VP doing this just gives me an option and suddenly removes it.
    Really, I'm totally ok with the half firepower, but about the victory points I'm going to be North Korean!!!  ;D

    Edit: maybe we could say this:
    -ld  check  with succeed  is full  firepower, with failed half.
    -Victory points conceded when disengaged

    But limitation, half firepower, possible  failure on 1 to "become real" AND conceding VP it's just shouting "To the shelf!!"
    « Last Edit: April 06, 2013, 09:09:56 PM by Neferhet »

    Offline afterimagedan

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #28 on: April 07, 2013, 06:07:28 AM »
    In would be willing to drop the victory points for warping out if we drop the +1 boarding. Give them mark of khorne And you have the best boarding in then game just about. I think a daemon ship doing what it does in going back into the warp should not find the enemy more victory points. So then, how does the daemon ship actually fully disengage? How do you get victory points at the disengage level against a daemon ship? Do you basically just have to blow it up? That's too powerful for a +20pt upgrade on a cruiser considering the bonus deployment rules as well. We can't give a cruiser +1 boarding, amazing deployment special rules, ability to disengage and heal up and reappear without penalty of victory points, all for just 20pts.

    How about this:
    Same deployment brethren posted
    No +1 boarding
    LD test to not be at half firepower (maybe)
    Spectral like we have been discussing and become normal on 2+.
    Haunting won't cause disengage VPs but if the ship is gone when the game would end, its considered disengaged. If the ship was crippled at any time, it is considered crippled for VP at the end of the game. It the ship disengages while crippled, it is considered disengaged for the purpose of VPs. (!!!)

    What about that?

    Offline AndrewChristlieb

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    Re: BFG:R Daemon Ships
    « Reply #29 on: April 07, 2013, 06:53:19 AM »

    Summary:

    • Availiability:
      • A Daemon Ship is an upgrade on any capital ship availiable to a chaos fleet (with the exception of unique ships) that can be taken once every 1000pts.
      This sounds like a reasonable limit.
    • Upgrade cost:
      • Battleship:          +40pts
      • Grand Cruiser:   +30pts
      • Heavy Cruiser:   +25pts
      • Cruiser:               +20pts
      • Light Cruiser:     +15pts
      What is the basis for these costs?
    • Special Rules:
      • General:
        • A Daemon cannot take a Commander or Chaos Space Marines, even if it is the biggest ship in the fleet..
        • It can be equipped with one Mark of Chaos.
        • A Daemon gets a boarding modifier of +1 due to its unnatural "crew" and "interior environment".
        • The Daemon's weapons follow the normal rules of weapons according to its ship class, even if these weapons are in fact something else entirely.
        Nice and simple, Im not convinced they need the extra boarding modifier tho.
      • Deployment:
        • May be kept off the table at normal deployment to be summoned later.
        • In any chaos end phase, pick one capital ship and position the Daemon within 20cm to it.
          Then roll a scatter die and 4D6 to see where the Daemon actually turnes up, facing a direction of the chaos player's choosing. At this point the Daemon is considered spectral.
        May? Are we implying they can be deployed during the standard deployment then ;).

        Why are we insisting on sticking with the absurd scatter die. Does anyone have a good reason to retain this considering the ship can move anyway.

      • Spectral:
        • A spectral Daemon moves normal according to the rules, but is not affected by obstacles like terrain or mines.
        • All ships within 15cm of a spectral Daemon get -1Ld.
        • A spectral Daemon may do nothing, except moving and becoming solid. It can't be targeted or harmed in return. In addition Chaos Marks that would affect other ships on the battlefield don't do so while the Daemon is spectral.
        • "Special Order: Become solid". At the beginning of the chaos players phase the Daemon can be given the special order to become solid to act as a normal ships can. Roll a leadership test to see if the Daemon managed the transition. Just roll once for squadrons of Daemons. "Become solid" halves the ships firepower on that turn. If successful the Daemon becomes solid and may act as a normal ship from now on.
          As usual the Daemon gets +1Ld if an enemy ship is on special orders this turn.
        This needs to be cleaned up. Why are we nerfingthe MoS? This has been cumulative since daemons were introduced. Im not a fan of the "special order", much better to just state:
        At the end of any subsequent Chaos Movement phase
        it may complete the translation to real space. It
        does not have to and may remain a spectral,
        haunting presence as long as the Chaos player
        wishes. When the decision is made to translate
        to real space roll a D6 - on a roll of 2 or more it
        becomes solid. This final translation cannot be
        made if the Daemonship is in contact with an
        enemy vessel. No actions can be undertaken in
        the Movement phase during which final translation
        occurs (no sneaky special orders or
        suchlike). From this point on the Daemonship is
        solid and fights like a normal ship.

      • Haunting:
        • At the beginning of the chaos player's phase a Daemon can disengage without taking a leadership test. The Daemon is considered to be back in the Warp. Simply remove it from the table.
        • Lurking in the Warp a Daemon can repair critical damage normally. Additionally it can enter the game again using the same rules as listed in "Deployment".
        • When the Daemon returns to the table roll a D6.
          • 1,2: nothing happens
          • 3,4: the Daemon regains 1 hit
          • 5,6: the Daemon regains 2 hits
          • add +1 to the roll for every turn the Daemon spent in the Warp after the first. The Daemon cannot get more hitpoints than a ship of its class would normally have.
          I really dislike them being able to even come back after disengaging much less gaining hit points back but if we must keep this then it shouldnt be any easier for them to regain those hit points. 1-3 no result, 4-5= 1 hit, 6= 2 hits seems like plenty.
        • The Daemon is still considered "disengaged" for the purposes of victory points.
      I can agree with dropping this *unless the ship is still disengaged at the end of the game. If the ship becomes crippled it should remain crippled for victory purposes reguardless of what its hit points are at the end of the game.



    USING DAEMON SHIPS IN
    BATTLEFLEET GOTHIC

    The basic profile of a ship, which is upgraded to
    a Daemon ship remains unchanged. It does not
    matter what broadside weapons you replace
    with Daemon ship components the ship’s
    profile is not changed.
    The points cost to upgrade a capital ship to a
    Daemon ship is as follows:
    Battleship . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +TBD points
    Grand cruiser . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +TBD points
    Heavy cruiser . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +TBD points
    Cruiser . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +TBD points
    A Daemon ship may not be commanded by a
    Warmaster or a Chaos Lord even if it is the
    largest ship in the fleet. This is an exception to
    the normal rule. A Daemon ship may not have a
    Chaos Space Marine crew. A maximum of one
    capital ship per 1000 points or part can be
    upgraded to Daemon ships subject to these
    limitations. Daemonships cannot be used in
    squadrons.
    Daemon ships cannot carry Exterminatus
    weapons and do not score any points for
    landing troops in a planetary assault (the
    Daemons are bound within the hull of their
    vessel, whilst able to board enemy ships
    normally in the context of a BFG game they
    would become unstable if holding a planetary
    objective for any length of time).
    Any Daemon ship may have a single Mark of
    Chaos with the same effects and cost in points
    as described in the Battlefleet Gothic rulebook.
    Daemon ship Leadership is rolled as normal (ie,
    1=6, 2,3=7, 4,5=8, 6=9).


    WARP TRANSLATION
    A Daemonship must be kept off table at the start
    of a game. The rest of the fleet is deployed as
    stated in the rules for the mission being played.
    The Daemonship(s) are actually lurking in the
    Warp waiting to either be summoned by one of
    the on-table Chaos ships or drawn to the ripe
    souls aboard an enemy ship. In the Movement
    phase of any Chaos turn, including the first, they
    may enter play from the Warp as follows:
    Select a friendly or enemy Capital ship, only a
    Capital ship contains enough supplicants or
    victims to draw a Daemonship from the Warp.
    Position the Daemonship within 20cm of the
    chosen vessel facing in any direction desired by
    the Chaos player controlling it.
    The arriving Daemonship is unaffected by
    celestial phenomena and does not trigger attack
    by ordnance markers in contact.

    SPECTRAL DAEMONSHIPS
    The Daemonship has now pierced the fabric of
    real space and has started to manifest itself. It is
    not entirely present in real space, however,
    although it is real enough for enemy vessels to
    track its location and react to its presence. It is
    in effect a spectre. Any enemy vessel attempting
    a special order when within 15cm of it is at -1
    Leadership (if the ship also has a Mark of
    Slaanesh the penalties are cumulative). Apart
    from this, it has no effect, can do nothing to
    affect enemy ships and cannot be harmed in
    return. It cannot launch ordnance, trigger
    mines, be affected by celestial phenomena,
    nothing, at all – OK!
    At the end of any subsequent Chaos Movement
    phase it may complete the translation to real
    space. It does not have to and may remain a
    spectral, haunting presence as long as the Chaos
    player wishes. When the decision is made to translate
    to real space make a leadership test. Reguardless of
    the result it becomes solid, but if the leadership test
    is failed the Daemonship will halve all weapons
    firepower and strengths until the end of the turn.
    This final translation cannot be made if the Daemonship
    is in contact with an enemy vessel. No actions can be
    undertaken in the movement phase during which final
    translation occurs except standard movement and turns
    (no sneaky special orders or suchlike). From this point
    on the Daemonship is solid and fights like a normal ship.
    If a Daemon ship fully materializes in contact with
    celestial phenomena, it suffers any effects of those
    celestial phenomena, such as gas clouds, asteroid
    fields, etc. before the start of its movement phase.
    However, if it materializes in an asteroid field, it may
    then attempt to avoid damage by making a leadership
    check normally.

    HAUNTING
    A Daemonship may disengage at the end of any
    Chaos Movement phase without having to make
    any dice roll. It simply drops back into the Warp
    leaving no trace.
    A disengaged Daemonship may re-enter play on
    any Chaos turn following the one in which it
    disengages. This is done following the
    translation rules detailed above.
    If it was damaged when it disengaged it may be
    repaired when it returns, roll a d6,

    1,2 or 3 No change.

    4 or 5 +1 hull point.

    6 +2 hull points.

    Add +1 to the roll if it is a battleship.

    Add +1 for each full turn the Daemonship spent
    in the Warp.

    A returning Daemonship cannot come back with
    more hits than it could normally have. A
    Daemonship will only count as disengaged if it is
    currently disengaged at the end of the game for
    Victory points purposes, unless of course it is
    destroyed or crippled, then the normal rules apply.
    A Daemonship which is crippled will always count
    as crippled for Victory points purposes, reguardless
    of how many hit points it has remaining at the end
    of the game.

    When a Daemonship is "haunting‟ or is spectral it
    can still suffer damage from fire critical hits. In
    addition to repairing damage, they may repair
    critical hits while in the warp rolling normally,
    repairing critical damage on a 4+ as opposed to a 6.

    Daemonships do not automatically regain hits after
    each battle. They have to be regained either in a game
    by warp translation or by expending repair points, or
    they can be withdrawn normally.

    Edited to replace the 2+ to become solid with the leadership test.
    Edited to add relevant revisions from the FAQ
    « Last Edit: April 07, 2013, 07:16:12 AM by AndrewChristlieb »
    I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.