BFG:R Space Marines

[afterimagedan]

@afterimagedan You have to admit, any opponent who the marines manage to board with THUNDERWOLVES or a BIKE HORDE is probably like, "Well F**k me, good game guys, I will be heading for the escape pod now..." I wish I could draw that would make awesome art.

I already did admit it! They should feel the same way when boarded by Thunderwolves as they do with Khorne Berzerkers. That's my argument, they should have similar game options.

The Savage Scars novel by Andy Hoare places an escort sized SM vessel at 5-10 marines, with strike cruisers at 30-100 marines and battlebarges at 100-300 marines. One would have to imagine that in most engagements, the entire chapter is not involved and thus most of those numbers are on the smaller side.

Those numbers look about right, mathematically. Totally depends on the chapter. Many chapters are fleet based only and you may encounter the entire thing in a fleet battle.

Chapter benefits should be a thing, minor and as a point addition. But he community clearly does not want this, so lets wait for the appendix and rock 'em, right Dan.

Agreed. Let's make an appendix of loyal and traitor options that you can buy. Like Berzerker, Thunderwolves, Deathwing, etc.

[horizon]

It was written in white dwarves that there are only a handfull marines on a vessel(when not transporting the company).

The captain will be the leader of a regular tactical squad, while another member of his squad could be installed as the captain of a accompaning escort.

So, yeah, 10 Marines or less on a Strike Cruiser is most common.

[afterimagedan]

It was written in white dwarves that there are only a handfull marines on a vessel(when not transporting the company).

The captain will be the leader of a regular tactical squad, while another member of his squad could be installed as the captain of a accompaning escort.

So, yeah, 10 Marines or less on a Strike Cruiser is most common.

I'll believe that it's "most common" when I see the reference.

[horizon]

I'll search the reference but it has been common knowledge ammung the community afaik .

[eyeslikethunder]

Nope 100 marines per strike cruiser

10 per rapid strike vessel

[Talos]

Part of the problem is that we are ignoring some fluff and not others; like I mentioned earlier, it is pretty rare to have as many SM in the field (other than fleet based chapters) as we play in games; a 1500pt fleet could have two battlebarges alongside a pair of strike cruisers and a squadron of escorts. The odds of the chapter pouring that many resources into one battle...it would have to be for their survival to warrant risking that many marines. In space, all it takes is one lucky shot to wipe out a third of the chapter after all. Other than the horus heresy and the battle for maccrage, the only references I have seen to such massive fleet engagements are the Iron Hands novel, the redemptive crusade in the new Chaos Codex and the Badab war.

It is fair to assume that if the chapter is fielding 75% of its vessels that it will have brought a lot of marines to woop ass...at least, that's the way I see it.

To add to specific chapters abilities, there is mention in the Deliverance Lost Horus Heresy novel that Corvus/Corax has had all the Raven Guard vessels modified with improved energy baffles and cloaking fields, allowing it to pass virtually invisible as long as the shields and other high energy systems were down. Later, if we were so inclined, the RG could buy mimic engines of sorts, to represent their silent approach.

In Fulgrim (Horus Heresy), there is reference to the Iron Hands vessels having lots of access to castellan void shields (bonus if your ship has them in RT), which basically allows some of their shields to pop back up sometimes after an overload. Could have upgrade that allows shields an save of sorts, 5 or 6+.

In Hunt for Valadorious (SM Battle Book), the White Scars have a ship that basically has evasive jets like the chart upgrade.

In Salamanders trilogy (tome of Fire 1-3), the salamanders have masterfully crafted hulls which are more resilient than other ships equivalents. No real way to implement this, but...

I could go on and on, but I think we can all agree that this can be a separate compendium for expediency's sake.

[horizon]

Nope 100 marines per strike cruiser

10 per rapid strike vessel

Wrong.

Only 100 on the Strike Cruiser if the company is being transported / toward planetary assault.
Otherwise 10 at max.

Which moronic chapter master would keep 100 of the Emperor's finest onboard a fragile ship in vast space?

[eyeslikethunder]

There are several example in the space wolf / grey knight war of them engaging in space with large numbers on board they were there to fight the battle they were engaged in

Not being transported to an Planetary assault

[eyeslikethunder]

Given the +2 boarding factor I think it's assumed more than deck crew are a board

[horizon]

What you miss: chapter serfs (serfs who did not make it into a true Marine) are still pretty awesome regarding fighting compared to normal humans. And they make up the bulk on a ship.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Space_Marine_Fleet

Unlike the vessels of the Imperial Navy, a Space Marine ship has a relatively small crew. A Space Marine is far too valuable to waste in manning a gun or watching a surveyor screen, and so only the officers aboard a vessel are likely to be Space Marines, as well as the few Techmarines who oversee the engines and perform other mechanical duties. Almost all the ship’s systems are run and monitored by servitors; half-human cyborgs who are wired into the vessel’s weapons, engines and communications apparatus. There are also a few hundred Chapter Serfs to attend to other duties, such as routine cleaning and maintenance, serving the Space Marines during meal times and other such honoured tasks. These serfs come from the Chapter’s home planet or the enclave they protect, many of them Novitiates or applicants who have failed some part of the recruiting or training process. These serfs are fanatically loyal to their superhuman masters, and indoctrinated into many of the lesser orders of the Chapter’s Cult. Although human, they still benefit from remarkable training and access to superior weaponry than is usually found on a naval vessel, making them a fearsome prospect in a boarding action – even without the support of their genetically modified lords.[1]

[eyeslikethunder]

Part of the problem is that we are ignoring some fluff and not others; like I mentioned earlier, it is pretty rare to have as many SM in the field (other than fleet based chapters) as we play in games; a 1500pt fleet could have two battlebarges alongside a pair of strike cruisers and a squadron of escorts. The odds of the chapter pouring that many resources into one battle...it would have to be for their survival to warrant risking that many marines. In space, all it takes is one lucky shot to wipe out a third of the chapter after all. Other than the horus heresy and the battle for maccrage, the only references I have seen to such massive fleet engagements are the Iron Hands novel, the redemptive crusade in the new Chaos Codex and the Badab war.

It is fair to assume that if the chapter is fielding 75% of its vessels that it will have brought a lot of marines to woop ass...at least, that's the way I see it.

To add to specific chapters abilities, there is mention in the Deliverance Lost Horus Heresy novel that Corvus/Corax has had all the Raven Guard vessels modified with improved energy baffles and cloaking fields, allowing it to pass virtually invisible as long as the shields and other high energy systems were down. Later, if we were so inclined, the RG could buy mimic engines of sorts, to represent their silent approach.

In Fulgrim (Horus Heresy), there is reference to the Iron Hands vessels having lots of access to castellan void shields (bonus if your ship has them in RT), which basically allows some of their shields to pop back up sometimes after an overload. Could have upgrade that allows shields an save of sorts, 5 or 6+.

In Hunt for Valadorious (SM Battle Book), the White Scars have a ship that basically has evasive jets like the chart upgrade.

In Salamanders trilogy (tome of Fire 1-3), the salamanders have masterfully crafted hulls which are more resilient than other ships equivalents. No real way to implement this, but...

I could go on and on, but I think we can all agree that this can be a separate compendium for expediency's sake.

Very true I think of few more big battles  though


But in vastness of the 40k universe they are rare events where the space marines are throwing everything they have at something
few more examples of upgrades
Stealth ships are seen in the raven guard(cruisers) and space wolf fleets(rapid strike vessel)

I am happy for it to wait

[eyeslikethunder]

What you miss: chapter serfs (serfs who did not make it into a true Marine) are still pretty awesome regarding fighting compared to normal humans. And they make up the bulk on a ship.

better than Chaos space marines.......

[horizon]

?
The Chaos ships in the Gothic sector do not have chaos marines on them.
You have to buy then in the armageddon pdf list as an add on,

From FAQ/Compendium 2010
https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzUyNjQzZTAtMDZiMS00ZjRlLWJjNzMtYTE5YmNjZjdjODQ1/edit?pli=1#docId=0Bw_dULEfC3rbNjlmZDQyNDYtNmU1NS00NWRjLTk1NzktMWFmZmM4NTk0OWM3

While these serfs make up the vast
bulk of crews aboard Space M arine vessels, the
Master of the Fleet also has a number of Space
Marines under his command, who act as high-
ranking officers aboard the fleet’s capital ships,
providing captains for individual vessels, leading
specialized boarding parties, or otherwise overseeing
the dedicated serfs who provide the bulk of a
vessel’s manpower.

In some cases, it will be the Master of the
Fleet’s own company that provides these Marines,
with each of his veteran captains acting as captain to
a different vessel within the fleet while their own
squad members each man a different vital area
within that same vessel.

[eyeslikethunder]

which are some reason not superior to load of guys who did not make the grade as marines. Also yet to see these guys in books involving boarding actions which suggest that failed marines should get +2 to boarding


As talos says virtually any battle represented by BFG is massve battle probably desperate battle for the chapter involving most its strength as a chapter.

Just look at the fluff any battle involving multiple battle barges / strike cruisers is massive, war of armageddon, black crusade, survival of the chapter stuff. 

[AndrewChristlieb]

The problem is that the ships dont represent the fluff. Theyre not fragile at all but having 500 point invulnerable strikes wouldnt make for much fun .