BFG:R Tyranids

[AndrewChristlieb]

Ok, its not like the bigger bugs dont already have sufficient shields.

[afterimagedan]

Ok, its not like the bigger bugs dont already have sufficient shields.

So Tyranid players have to choose between a grand cruiser/battleship with 3 shields and a 30 hit, 5 shield hulk? That's lame.

[AndrewChristlieb]

I think you misunderstand me. When i said the bigger bugs have suffecient shields i was refering to the adult hives. Of course the battleship and smaller vessels should retain the ability to gain an additional shield. I dont think it would be such a big deal for battleships to have the same price as cruisers tho. If its a set 15 points for a shield thats fine, i dont even know if it would be that big of a deal for the space hulk seeing as even with +1 it would still only have 4 total.

[afterimagedan]

I think you misunderstand me. When i said the bigger bugs have suffecient shields i was refering to the adult hives. Of course the battleship and smaller vessels should retain the ability to gain an additional shield. I dont think it would be such a big deal for battleships to have the same price as cruisers tho. If its a set 15 points for a shield thats fine, i dont even know if it would be that big of a deal for the space hulk seeing as even with +1 it would still only have 4 total.

Gotcha. Though, the adult hive (if that's what you mean by hulk) has 5 shields right now. So let's put it at 15pts, no escorts, no adult hive. Sound good?

I see what Plaxor was doing; he made Massive Claws into 1D6 attacks each and upped the number of claws each vessel has. Let's keep the old version.

SHIPS
Adult Hive - No idea yet though from what I am calculating, it's a ways underpriced.

Adolescent Hive - Smothermans out to 250 with 5+ armor. That is where I would put it.

-Juvenile Hive smothermans to 157.5 but will have a few knocked off because of "massive" quality (meaning cannot use CTNH special orders). This is when I have it at 5+ armor. 155pts.

-Kraken Carnivore - This smothermans out to 110 with 5+ armor (not 5+/4+ rear) and switching to the old massive claws would mean that we should have 1 dorsal and 1 keep (not 2 and 2)

-Leviathan Prowler smothermans (yes, it's a verb) to 64 pts, and adding the highlighter quality that the vanguard drones get, seems like it would bring it to 70, where it's at now.

-Emergent drone ship smothermans correctly at 60 pts. I think this is an awesome ship for tyranids to have for transports.

-Kraken predators. The question is, do we make it 2 hits & 1 shield? 2 hits, 4+save? 1 hit, 4=save? I think the weapon profiles have to change because we are not using plaxors massive claw rules but the old version (I assume). Deathburner breed is fine. Ramsmiter should be feeder tendrils 1, massive claws 1, pyroacid 2. Comparing it with the old points costs, that should make them at even points.

-Leviathan Vanguard profile is fine. Very similar to the old Vanguard.

-Drone Escort should be 25pts with 5+ armor, the pyroacid option should have 4 pyroacid, not 3, the bioplasma option should have 2 bioplasma, not 1. This makes it closer to the old version.

[afterimagedan]

If there is an option for random Evolutions, bar adding more like the standard refit tables, then I think 11 should be the maximum # (2-12 on 2D6). I would also like to see there being a benifit to taking random evolutions such as being able to take the first randomly generated result for free.

Also, we need to make sure the random evolution chart is in the same order the old chart is because some numbers on 2D6 will come up more often than others. Hold me to that.

[Talos]

Im all for the 25pts idea...and the psychic scream as hive ship upgrade.

Are we keeping the cruiser kraken from BFG:R?

[afterimagedan]

Yeah, that's the kraken carnivore. I think we need to add back the torpedo option because I know people really like the torpedo kraken option.

[Talos]

Even with boarding torps only, it is a real cool design admittedly. It always seemed very aggressively costed for its firepower versus other nid capitals, which is probably why it was popular. Also, 15pt shields for cruisers seem fine, although still seems like almost an auto-buy. Mind you, anything higher is unreasonable. Also, orks should have cheaper upgrades for their shields.

[afterimagedan]

Alight, after comparing a bunch of point stuff and smotherman formulas for the Adult Hive, I am convinced that it's the right point cost, actually, maybe over points. BUT, that's ok. Basically, 480pts is a rounded up cost of 476.1 and is NOT accounting for the lack of a turn or having a 4+ save. But, I think it's fair to not count that knowing that it has unreasonable hits and shields.

[Talos]

Fair enough...by 4+save I presume you mean 4+ armor?

[afterimagedan]

Fair enough...by 4+save I presume you mean 4+ armor?

Yep

[afterimagedan]

Are you guys alright with me attempting to make a document with mostly just the old Tyranid rules with some of the new tweaks we have been talking about? Then, you guys will have a document to check out and we can take some votes after more discussion.

[AndrewChristlieb]

That sounds good too me. Gives us a place to build from.

[afterimagedan]

If there is an option for random Evolutions, bar adding more like the standard refit tables, then I think 11 should be the maximum # (2-12 on 2D6). I would also like to see there being a benifit to taking random evolutions such as being able to take the first randomly generated result for free.

How would we word this in the rules? I think this is an awesome inclusion but how would we make it work? How about:

"If you evolve any adolescent or adult hive ship with two evolutions, you may roll 2D6 for a third evolution on the chart for free instead of purchasing a third."

[afterimagedan]

Also, we only have 10 evolutions now and we need 11 for the randomness chart. Mega Spore Mines? Psychic Scream?