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Author Topic: BFG:R Tyranids  (Read 21350 times)

Offline afterimagedan

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BFG:R Tyranids
« on: October 26, 2012, 04:23:47 PM »
Changes (some of which are Plaxor's):
(keep in mind, when reading this, Plaxor's fleet point means full 1,000pts)
-Swap some of the names around, ex. Kraken Predator to Predator Kraken (Plaxor's)
-Add back in double launch capacity (Plaxor's)
-Add a bioplasma Kraken Predator (Plaxor's)
-Predator Kraken to 25cm move (like they used to be)
-I do not like the global evolutions stuff because there are two that you simply must take to be competitive (armor upgrade).
       Here's how I think it should work:
-Each adult or adolescent hive ship get 4 points of evolutions they can choose. This will be accounted for in the points cost. Juvenile hive ships get 3 points.
-kraken carnivore, and leviathan prowler can choose 2 points of evolutions, which is worked into their points cost.
-Every 500pt of a game you are playing, you can spend 1 point on evolutions on escort squadrons.

-I think the increased armor evolution should become a +2 hits evolution. That way, it is more like the old rules, hive ships aren't stuck at 10 hits, and the armor that people would have always evolved would just be written in the stat line of the ship.

-Also, if we are going to go on the macro level with instinctive behavior (as opposed to 40k level), why not keep synapse?  One thing to remember, the reason Plaxor has the standard Tyranid leadership as 6 is because his rules give light cruisers adding +1 ld to squadrons around them (this is something he told me specifically).

-I think Kraken from the old rules should replace the new Kraken Predator profile. The old no shield but always on brace added a lot of character to them.

-I think we should bring back the armor values of the old rules for each ship and throw in some armor upgrade options, maybe to upgrade the prow of carnivore kraken,

-One of the harder parts about playing Tyranids was getting your hive ships into offensive range. They do only move 15cm, even the adolescent ones. I think it would be best to give their wbs, a range boost (combined with a points boost of course). Realistically, most people will be fielding adolescent hives (which is the rules for the GW hive model). I think it should be bumped up to the 300pt - 325pt range. Also, I think it is under-priced at this point, especially with 4 evolution points and double launch capacity.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2012, 04:47:13 PM by afterimagedan »

Offline Talos

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2012, 04:41:00 PM »
Well, here goes:

1) In agreement with name swaps; just makes sense really.
2) Bioplasma kraken is the bomb; nuff said
3) Double launch bay capacity is a requirement for nids; their ordnance is crappy as all hell but very numerous
4) Kraken should be fast; the bugs need at least one decent speed unit just to compete against faster fleets
5) We have already discussed between us the evolution chart; great concept, mediocre execution (no bash to plaxor, just really hard to pull off)

Are we keeping his list of evolutions? We should probably make a full list of upgrades from BBB and BFG:R and have people vote to tweak/keep/discard them.
As for your escort number, better to give it a static number for simplicity's sake, I say.

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2012, 08:08:48 PM »
Well, here goes:

1) In agreement with name swaps; just makes sense really.
yep
2) Bioplasma kraken is the bomb; nuff said
yep
3) Double launch bay capacity is a requirement for nids; their ordnance is crappy as all hell but very numerous
yep
4) Kraken should be fast; the bugs need at least one decent speed unit just to compete against faster fleets
bringing back the old stats will help them with that
5) We have already discussed between us the evolution chart; great concept, mediocre execution (no bash to plaxor, just really hard to pull off)

Are we keeping his list of evolutions? We should probably make a full list of upgrades from BBB and BFG:R and have people vote to tweak/keep/discard them.
As for your escort number, better to give it a static number for simplicity's sake, I say.
probably. I will make a list right now

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2012, 09:13:23 PM »
I am going to strikethrough ones I think we should get rid of.

Old Nids:
-Solar Vanes . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +15 pts
The ship gains +5cm speed. fine

-Adrenaline Sacs . . . . . . . . . . +10 pts
The ship gains +1D6 when on All Ahead Full special orders. fine

-Psychic Scream . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
Any enemy vessels within 15cm suffer -2Ld. Intended solely for hive ships. was expensive. should probably be changed  30cm and -1.

-More Discharge Vents . . . . . . +15 pts
The creature reduces the distance it needs to move before turning by 5cm. Not intended for escorts. starting a special rule with the word "more" is kind of crappy. Let's call is "advanced discharge vents."
 
-Extra Spore Cysts . . . . . +10 pts each
The ship gains one spore cyst. No more than two spore cysts can be gained in this manner. this is obsolete with shields now. drop.

-Reinforced Carapace . . . +10 pts each
The ship gains +1 Hit. No more than four additional Hits may be gained in this manner. If rolling randomly, a cruiser which attains 10 Hits in this way matures into a hive ship! Not intended for escorts. keep but make it just give +2 hits, not allowed for escorts.

-Mucous Membrane . . . . . . . . +20 pts
Bombers and assault boats suffer a -1 modifier (in addition to any other modifiers) when rolling their Attack roll, and all torpedoes must roll +1 to hit (maximum of 6+). Ranged weapon hits remain unaffected. fine

-Accelerated Healing . . . . . . . +10 pts
The bio-ship has enhanced its ability to heal critical wounds, enabling capital ships to roll two extra dice in the End phase when attempting to repair critical damage. Not intended for escorts. fine

-Drone Link . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
The creature maintains an unbroken link with the Vanguard drone ships and hive ships of the swarm. When within 15cm of a Vanguard drone ship, all pyro-acid batteries benefit from a left
shift on the Gunnery table (before all other modifiers). fine

-Tenacity . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
When on All Ahead Full, Burn Retros or Come to New Heading special orders, its pyro-acid batteries and bio-plasma weapons are unaffected. fine but should probably be 15pts

-Mega-Spore Mines . . . . . . . .+10 pts per launch bay
Ships equipped with assault boat launch bays can exchange all their launch bays for spore mine launchers. Each launch bay can launch one mega-spore mine In the Ordnance phase Megaspore mines follow all movement and ordnance rules mines do on p.142 of the rulebook, but when rolling against armour to inflict hits, it inflicts that number of fire criticals instead. Not intended for escorts. I think this should only cost 1 evolution point but cost points per launch bay also.

it seems to me like that 10pts corresponds to 1 evolution point, 15pts to 2 evolution points, and 20pts to 3 evolution points.

New PDF Evolutions:

3 Spore Cysts -  The Fleet has evolved organs which release numerous spores, concealing the Vessels in a living
cloud, and making targeting them rather difficult. The Vessels have the Holofields quality. new evolution. I'm not sure what I think about it but I like the fluff.

3 Tenacity - The Fleet has evolved a reorganized body structure better able to take the blows from enemy
fire and detonations. Vessels have Living Hull (2) instead of Living Hull (1). can't find what living hull is, I may be blanking

3 Drone Link - The Fleet has evolved large neural networks devoted to targeting. The Vessels gain Improved
Tracking Systems. new evolution

3 Reinforced Carapace - The Fleet has evolved a hardened carapace. Add 1 to of the Vessel’s Armour Characteristics (to a maximum of 6+). new evolution. i don't think it's needed if we have the built in armor that tyranids should have.

2 Solar Vanes - The Fleet has evolved organs which are able to absorb energy from sunlight and convert it to
momentum. Vessels add +5 to their Speed Characteristic. same as the old


2 Discharge Vents - The Fleet has evolved additional Discharge Vents used to manoeuvre. Vessels add 45˚ to their Turns Characteristic. new evolution. don't think it's needed.

2 Mucous Membrane - The Fleet has evolved organs which surround the Vessels in a thin layer of sticky mucous, and making Ordnance attacks difficult. Vessels gain Fast Tracking Turrets. new evolution

1 Adrenaline Sacs - The Fleet has evolved adrenaline releasing organs allowing a quick boost in speed. Vessels gain Improved Thrusters. same as the old

1 Accelerated Healing - The Fleet has evolved an ability to heal minor damage absurdly fast. Vessels gain Augmented Damage Control. modified old one.

1 Natural Killer Antibodies - The Fleet has evolved a more efficient Ordnance defence creature. Vessels add +1 to their Turrets Characteristic. new evolution

1 Hardened Myelin - The Fleet has increased the thickness of the myelin sheath around its dendrites, improving
cognitive function. Each Node gains 1 re-roll, free of cost. new evolution

1 Shadow Hive Mind - The Fleet has evolved a more powerful Hive Mind, and is able to plan attacks more
efficiently. The Fleet’s Attack Rating is increased by 1. May not be taken in an allied Fleet. new evolution. we should change the name of it to "Pheromone Trigger", like what happens with bees who switch on attack mode.

i will edit this later
« Last Edit: October 27, 2012, 01:36:43 AM by afterimagedan »

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2012, 12:31:57 AM »
Here's my proposed solution to the Evolution chart:

Certain ships come with evolution points you spend before the game. Adult and Adolescent hives get 4, Juvenile gets 3, Carnivore and Leviathan Prowler get 2. For each 500 points the game is, you can spend 1 Evolution point on escort squads.

Cost  Evolution
1       Natural Killer Antibodies - The Fleet has evolved a more efficient Ordnance defense creature. Vessels add +1 to their Turrets Characteristic.

1       Hardened Myelin - The Fleet has increased the thickness of the myelin sheath around its dendrites, improving cognitive function. The vessel or squadron gains 1 re-roll, free of cost.

1       Pheromone Rage - The Fleet has evolved a more powerful Hive Mind, and is able to plan attacks more
efficiently. The Fleet’s Attack Rating is increased by 1. May not be taken in an allied Fleet and may only be taken on a Hive ship or any kind.

1       Accelerated Healing - The bio-ship has enhanced its ability to heal critical wounds, enabling capital ships to roll two extra dice in the End phase when attempting to repair critical damage. Not allowed on escorts.

1       Adrenaline Sacs - The ship gains +1D6 when on All Ahead Full special orders

1      Mega-Spore Mines - Ships equipped with assault boat launch bays can exchange all their launch bays for spore mine launchers. Each launch bay can launch one mega-spore mine In the Ordnance phase Megaspore mines follow all movement and ordnance rules mines do on p.142 of the rulebook, but when rolling against armour to inflict hits, it inflicts that number of fire criticals instead. Not intended for escorts. This also costs +10pts per launch bay.

2      Advanced Discharge Vents - The creature reduces the distance it needs to move before turning by 5cm. Not intended for escorts.

2      Reinforced Carapace - The ship gains +2 hits. Not allowed on escorts.

2      Solar Vanes - The ship or squadron gains +5cm speed.

2     Tenacity - When on All Ahead Full, Burn Retros or Come to New Heading special orders, its pyro-acid batteries and bio-plasma weapons are unaffected.

3      Psychic Scream - Any enemy vessels withing 30cm suffer -1Ld. This may only be taken on hive ships.

3      Mucous Membrance - Bombers and assault boats suffer a -1 modifier (in addition to any other modifiers) when rolling their Attack roll, and all torpedoes must roll +1 to hit (maximum of 6+). Ranged weapon hits remain unaffected.

3      Drone Link - The creature maintains an unbroken link with the Vanguard drone ships and hive ships of the swarm. When within 15cm of a Vanguard drone ship, all pyro-acid batteries benefit from a left
shift on the Gunnery table (before all other modifiers).

3 Spore Cysts -  The Fleet has evolved organs which release numerous spores, concealing the Vessels in a living
cloud, and making targeting them rather difficult. The Vessels have the Holofields quality


Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2012, 01:23:02 AM »
I am going to strikethrough ones I think we should get rid of.

Old Nids:
-Solar Vanes . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +15 pts
The ship gains +5cm speed. fine Escorts? 5pts each?

-Adrenaline Sacs . . . . . . . . . . +10 pts
The ship gains +1D6 when on All Ahead Full special orders. fine Same as above?

-Psychic Scream . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
Any enemy vessels within 15cm suffer -2Ld. Intended solely for hive ships. was expensive. should probably be changed  30cm and -1. 20pts 30cm range -1 cumulative upto -3 this would be good for the MoS also

-More Discharge Vents . . . . . . +15 pts
The creature reduces the distance it needs to move before turning by 5cm. Not intended for escorts. starting a special rule with the word "more" is kind of crappy. Let's call is "advanced discharge vents." hum... More is blah not to sure about advanced either tho, additional?
 
-Extra Spore Cysts . . . . . +10 pts each
The ship gains one spore cyst. No more than two spore cysts can be gained in this manner. this is obsolete with shields now. drop.

-Reinforced Carapace . . . +10 pts each
The ship gains +1 Hit. No more than four additional Hits may be gained in this manner. If rolling randomly, a cruiser which attains 10 Hits in this way matures into a hive ship! Not intended for escorts. keep but make it just give +2 hits, not allowed for escorts. So no more growing into a Hive ship? I kinda like that idea actually, simplifies it a bit.

-Mucous Membrane . . . . . . . . +20 pts
Bombers and assault boats suffer a -1 modifier (in addition to any other modifiers) when rolling their Attack roll, and all torpedoes must roll +1 to hit (maximum of 6+). Ranged weapon hits remain unaffected. fine This seems really powerful.

-Accelerated Healing . . . . . . . +10 pts
The bio-ship has enhanced its ability to heal critical wounds, enabling capital ships to roll two extra dice in the End phase when attempting to repair critical damage. Not intended for escorts. fine

-Drone Link . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
The creature maintains an unbroken link with the Vanguard drone ships and hive ships of the swarm. When within 15cm of a Vanguard drone ship, all pyro-acid batteries benefit from a left
shift on the Gunnery table (before all other modifiers). fine so just when within 15 of a drone or drones and hives? the fluffy bit there seems to indicate both.

-Tenacity . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +20 pts
When on All Ahead Full, Burn Retros or Come to New Heading special orders, its pyro-acid batteries and bio-plasma weapons are unaffected. fine but should probably be 15pts o_O of any options I think this one should be 10% as its very dependant on the weapons load as to how powerful it is, rounded up of course, no sill 33 pt nonsense ;)

-Mega-Spore Mines . . . . . . . .+10 pts per launch bay
Ships equipped with assault boat launch bays can exchange all their launch bays for spore mine launchers. Each launch bay can launch one mega-spore mine In the Ordnance phase Megaspore mines follow all movement and ordnance rules mines do on p.142 of the rulebook, but when rolling against armour to inflict hits, it inflicts that number of fire criticals instead. Not intended for escorts. I think this should only cost 1 evolution point but cost points per launch bay also. Seems pricy, but then so do Torpedo bombers.

it seems to me like that 10pts corresponds to 1 evolution point, 15pts to 2 evolution points, and 20pts to 3 evolution points.

New PDF Evolutions:

3 Spore Cysts -  The Fleet has evolved organs which release numerous spores, concealing the Vessels in a living
cloud, and making targeting them rather difficult. The Vessels have the Holofields quality. new evolution. I'm not sure what I think about it but I like the fluff. I like it and it helps ease the transition from having spores to not, potential to be overpowered (Adult Hive with Spore Cysts o_O!!!)

3 Tenacity - The Fleet has evolved a reorganized body structure better able to take the blows from enemy
fire and detonations. Vessels have Living Hull (2) instead of Living Hull (1). can't find what living hull is, I may be blanking Got me? sounds like Necron auto save tho, isnt Tenacity already the name of another upgrade?

3 Drone Link - The Fleet has evolved large neural networks devoted to targeting. The Vessels gain Improved
Tracking Systems. new evolution Also hasnt this name already been used? What is an Improved tracking system... ;)

3 Reinforced Carapace - The Fleet has evolved a hardened carapace. Add 1 to of the Vessel’s Armour Characteristics (to a maximum of 6+). new evolution. i don't think it's needed if we have the built in armor that tyranids should have.  Agreed, altho you know I want an Adult hive with this and holofields, and a large fry


2 Solar Vanes - The Fleet has evolved organs which are able to absorb energy from sunlight and convert it to
momentum. Vessels add +5 to their Speed Characteristic. same as the old
[/s]

2 Discharge Vents - The Fleet has evolved additional Discharge Vents used to manoeuvre. Vessels add 45˚ to their Turns Characteristic. new evolution. don't think it's needed. Oh look, it does sound pretty good with "additional" :P

2 Mucous Membrane - The Fleet has evolved organs which surround the Vessels in a thin layer of sticky mucous, and making Ordnance attacks difficult. Vessels gain Fast Tracking Turrets. new evolution

So this instead of the other mucous?

1 Adrenaline Sacs - The Fleet has evolved adrenaline releasing organs allowing a quick boost in speed. Vessels gain Improved Thrusters. same as the old

1 Accelerated Healing - The Fleet has evolved an ability to heal minor damage absurdly fast. Vessels gain Augmented Damage Control. modified old one.

1 Natural Killer Antibodies - The Fleet has evolved a more efficient Ordnance defence creature. Vessels add +1 to their Turrets Characteristic. new evolution 10pts maximum of 1?

1 Hardened Myelin - The Fleet has increased the thickness of the myelin sheath around its dendrites, improving
cognitive function. Each Node gains 1 re-roll, free of cost. new evolution 25 pts?

1 Shadow Hive Mind - The Fleet has evolved a more powerful Hive Mind, and is able to plan attacks more
efficiently. The Fleet’s Attack Rating is increased by 1. May not be taken in an allied Fleet. new evolution. we should change the name of it to "Pheromone Trigger", like what happens with bees who switch on attack mode. I guess for people that use that nonsense this might be useful?
Here's my proposed solution to the Evolution chart:

Certain ships come with evolution points you spend before the game. Adult and Adolescent hives get 4, Juvenile gets 3, Carnivore and Leviathan Prowler get 2. For each 500 points the game is, you can spend 1 Evolution point on escort squads.

Cost  Evolution
1       Natural Killer Antibodies - The Fleet has evolved a more efficient Ordnance defense creature. Vessels add +1 to their Turrets Characteristic. cool, 10 pts 5 each for escorts? max of +1?

1       Hardened Myelin - The Fleet has increased the thickness of the myelin sheath around its dendrites, improving cognitive function. The vessel or squadron gains 1 re-roll, free of cost. same as before 25pts? maximum allowed?

1       Pheromone Rage - The Fleet has evolved a more powerful Hive Mind, and is able to plan attacks more
efficiently. The Fleet’s Attack Rating is increased by 1. May not be taken in an allied Fleet and may only be taken on a Hive ship or any kind. pts cost? I have no experiance to judge this on :/

1       Accelerated Healing - The bio-ship has enhanced its ability to heal critical wounds, enabling capital ships to roll two extra dice in the End phase when attempting to repair critical damage. Not allowed on escorts. Cool, 10pts?

1       Adrenaline Sacs - The ship gains +1D6 when on All Ahead Full special orders also good, 10 pts again, 5 for escorts?

1      Mega-Spore Mines - Ships equipped with assault boat launch bays can exchange all their launch bays for spore mine launchers. Each launch bay can launch one mega-spore mine In the Ordnance phase Megaspore mines follow all movement and ordnance rules mines do on p.142 of the rulebook, but when rolling against armour to inflict hits, it inflicts that number of fire criticals instead. Not intended for escorts. This also costs +10pts per launch bay. So is this one upgrade for ALL the launch bays +pts or just one pair?

2      Advanced Discharge Vents - The creature reduces the distance it needs to move before turning by 5cm. Not intended for escorts. Cool, not so sure if this is worth 15, maybe 10pts?

2      Reinforced Carapace - The ship gains +2 hits. Not allowed on escorts. Maximum of 1?, +20pts?

2      Solar Vanes - The ship or squadron gains +5cm speed. 10 and 5 for escorts? 15 seems a bit high once again

2     Tenacity - When on All Ahead Full, Burn Retros or Come to New Heading special orders, its pyro-acid batteries and bio-plasma weapons are unaffected. still think this should be 10% rounded up

3      Psychic Scream - Any enemy vessels withing 30cm suffer -1Ld. This may only be taken on hive ships. I like it, make it cumulative to a certain point (-3 for example)

3      Mucous Membrance - Bombers and assault boats suffer a -1 modifier (in addition to any other modifiers) when rolling their Attack roll, and all torpedoes must roll +1 to hit (maximum of 6+). Ranged weapon hits remain unaffected. Good, but should be pricy imo, 20-30pts?

3      Drone Link - The creature maintains an unbroken link with the Vanguard drone ships and hive ships of the swarm. When within 15cm of a Vanguard drone ship, all pyro-acid batteries benefit from a left
shift on the Gunnery table (before all other modifiers). 20 pts? and same question only when within 15 of a drone or drones and hives?

3 Spore Cysts -  The Fleet has evolved organs which release numerous spores, concealing the Vessels in a living
cloud, and making targeting them rather difficult. The Vessels have the Holofields quality I really like this too, should probably also be based off the ship cost as the more hits/better the armor the more effective this will become 10% rounded up?


[/color]

i will edit this later
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.

Offline Talos

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2012, 05:37:15 AM »
Oh sweet jesus my eyes...this reposting stuff is making this thread very hard to follow. Also, despite my earlier confusion, Living Hull (X) is and interesting mechanic. It's basically a port of It Will Not Die from W40K. Basically at every end step if the ship has no criticals you may roll a d6 for every 2 hull points remaining (round down): for every roll that exceeds the living hull value the ship regains 1 hit.

What do you guys think? Kind of cool and flavorful for nids, no?

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2012, 06:27:08 AM »
Each one may only be taken once by any squadron or ship.

Tyranid Evolutions
the following are exactly like the original tyranid list except for the potential for escort upgrades:
Solar Vanes - The ship or squadron gains +5cm speed. 10pts per capital ship and 5pts per escort just like AndrewChristlieb had it

Adrenaline Sacs - The ship gains +1D6 when on All Ahead Full special orders it should be 10 and 5. IN grand cruisers get the upgrade for 5 points.

Advanced Discharge Vents - The creature reduces the distance it needs to move before turning by 5cm. Not intended for escorts. 10pts 10pts seems right. This is a decent choice for 15cm moving hive ships

Extra Spore Cysts - The vessel gains 1 extra shield. May not be taken on escorts. 10pts

Accelerated Healing - The bio-ship has enhanced its ability to heal critical wounds, enabling capital ships to roll two extra dice in the End phase when attempting to repair critical damage. Not allowed on escorts. 10pts.

Drone Link - The creature maintains an unbroken link with the Vanguard drone ships and hive ships of the swarm. When within 15cm of a Vanguard drone ship, all pyro-acid batteries benefit from a left
shift on the Gunnery table (before all other modifiers). 20pts and 5pts per escort. 20pts like the old rules but making this available to escorts for 5pts makes sense. That will scale with the size of the escort squadron.

Tenacity - When on All Ahead Full, Burn Retros, or Come to New Heading special orders, the ship's pyro-acid batteries and bio-plasma weapons are unaffected. The cost of this upgrade is 10% of the vessels initial points cost rounded up to the nearest multiple of 5.  AndrewChristlieb, your 10% and round up option for this upgrade is the best thought I have heard all day. You deserve a cookie.  :D


the following are modified old evolutions
Psychic Scream - Any enemy vessels withing 30cm suffer -1Ld. Enemy ships can be effected by multiple psychic screams at once, to a maximum of -3ld. This may only be taken on hive ships. 20pts ...like the old psychic scream was. good call on the max of -3 rule

Reinforced Carapace - The ship gains +2 hits. Not allowed on escorts. 20pts ... just like the old evolutions but this restricts it to +2 hits ever.

Mucous Membrance - Bombers and assault boats suffer a -1 modifier (in addition to any other modifiers) when rolling their Attack roll, and all torpedoes must roll +1 to hit (maximum of 6+). Ranged weapon hits remain unaffected.  The cost of this upgrade is 10% of the vessels initial points cost rounded up to the nearest 5's digit.I think we should use this pricing system because it is that much better on ships with more hits. Consider this on an adult hive.......

Mega-Spore Mines - Ships equipped with assault boat launch bays can exchange all their launch bays for spore mine launchers. Each launch bay can launch one mega-spore mine In the Ordnance phase Megaspore mines follow all movement and ordnance rules mines do on p.142 of the rulebook, but when rolling against armour to inflict hits, it inflicts that number of fire criticals instead. Not intended for escorts. The launch bay strength is replaced by spore mine launchers at a 1:1 ratio. This also costs +5pts per launch bay strength. 5pts per is a much more appropriate value. Orks get mines for 5pts per in FAQ2010 and their ships are the same speed. Also, these don't get the benefits of double launch capacity so it's even with Orks. True, these are fire criticals, but normal orbital mines that roll a hit cause a guaranteed damage whereas spore mines cause fire crits that can be repaired. In the long run, these have the potential to do more, but I think it evens out, if not the spore mines being a slight bit worse, certainly not worth 10pts each. EDIT: when looking at the BFG:R list now, most tyranid carrier HAVE spore mines in them and there are special rules for them. Maybe we should just drop this and make the rules for mega spore mines into the rules for the normal spore mines tyranid carriers come with (the fire criticals damage instead of normal damage)

newly invented one
Natural Killer Antibodies - The Fleet has evolved a more efficient Ordnance defense creature. Vessels add +1 to their Turrets Characteristic. +10pts per capital ship, +5 points per escort. turret upgrades for IN ships are 10pts so 10pts for capital ships and 5 per escort makes sense. I think this could be dropped if the hive ships just had this upgrade built into their stats for the correct points.

drop list
Hardened Myelin - The Fleet has increased the thickness of the myelin sheath around its dendrites, improving cognitive function. The vessel or squadron gains 1 re-roll, free of cost, that may only be used on that ship or squardon. 15pts. this is exactly like the eldar farseers from MMS and they are 15pts. I think this should be dropped and added to the fleet list as Hive Imperatives

Pheromone Rage - The Fleet has evolved a more powerful Hive Mind, and is able to plan attacks more
efficiently. The Fleet’s Attack Rating is increased by 1. May not be taken in an allied Fleet and may only be taken on a Hive ship or any kind. 10pts 10 points. many people do not use attack ratings so who cares, attack rating does not mean all that much, and it will take up valuable upgrade points. this isn't a necessary inclusion. Maybe something that can be in the fleet list?

Spore Cysts -  The Fleet has evolved organs which release numerous spores, concealing the Vessels in a living cloud, and making targeting them rather difficult. The Vessels have the Holofields quality The cost of this upgrade is 10% of the vessels initial points cost rounded up to the nearest multiple of 5. this is super fluffy to me and I think it will be quite characterful in game. Let's drop it in favor of the original +1 shield option.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 04:23:34 AM by afterimagedan »

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2012, 06:31:12 AM »
Oh sweet jesus my eyes...this reposting stuff is making this thread very hard to follow.
HAHA right after I pressed post on my last brick of text, I saw that you posted this while I was writing it.

Also, despite my earlier confusion, Living Hull (X) is and interesting mechanic. It's basically a port of It Will Not Die from W40K. Basically at every end step if the ship has no criticals you may roll a d6 for every 2 hull points remaining (round down): for every roll that exceeds the living hull value the ship regains 1 hit.

What do you guys think? Kind of cool and flavorful for nids, no?
wait, if tyranids are living hull (1), won't they be regenerating tons of hits? How would that work out seeing that Tyranids have living hull (1)?

Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2012, 12:44:53 PM »
Alright pricing seems good.

Living hull... Still sounds like crons, do they have this too? Please no... Lol. It wouldnt be too bad if it cannot be used when on special orders or crippled, especially when coupled with half hits and half again when blast markers are in contact.
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.

Offline afterimagedan

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2012, 04:12:14 PM »
I also think we should add:

Extra Spore Cysts for 10pts, may only be taken once and not available to escorts. Essentially, instead of making this available to specific ships for the points cost, having this on the evolution chart makes it a more difficult option to take because ships will be constricted to how many evolutions they can take.

Offline Talos

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2012, 06:14:25 PM »
Sorry, I'm kind of unsure of the interpretation...Living Hull is the amount of dice you get to roll, and it heals on a 6+ like crits. Really tired when I wrote that. :P

About the 10% cost, rounded up thing....first of, good idea Andrew. Really solid, and the rounding up part should have been in this game from the very beginning. However, since there are only a limited amount of capital ships in the 'nid fleet, that ruling needs to specify original cost, or esle we risk having the upgrades get exponentialy more expensive. Once we have ship prices worked out, how about we just toss out the 10% and add it in at its fixed value to avoid confusion?

Ex. We decide an adolescent hive ship is worth 220pts (just a random number). 10% rounded up is 25pts (or 20 if we round to closest), so we should list it as costing 25pts on this ship rather than 10%. Or to save space we specify "this upgrade cost 10% of the vessels base value, before other refits or evolutions".

@afterimagedan you mean restricted by evolutions they can take, right? ;D :P

Offline horizon

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2012, 06:19:30 PM »
Somehow I feel uncomfortable rewriting a race in such a large way. This is a lot more then fixing stats/ships.


Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2012, 06:47:46 PM »
I havent gone over all of the change plaxor had in there, what all do you not like? I know Im not too hot on thrm having shields... Spores were a welcome change to the norm and very fluffy.
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.

Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: BFG:R Tyranids
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2012, 06:55:13 PM »
10% of total base cost after weapons have been selected. I cant claim credit either :/ thats the standard refit rule :D.

How about makin the random option worth taking? If you decide to take random evolutions the first one you roll is applied for free?
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.