September 13, 2024, 04:19:50 AM

Author Topic: Imperial Battlegroup Omega  (Read 4709 times)

Offline Pembo

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Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« on: November 01, 2011, 11:50:47 AM »
As posted over in the modelling section i'm making my rogue traders part of my Imperial fleet. I'm aiming for it to be 1500pts, but I dont think I have all the ships I need yet.

The fleet is meant to represent the Imperial forces of an isolated sub-sector. A low priority was given to the sub-sector since it contained no vital forge worlds, meaning no battleships were assigned to the battlegroup. Imperial authorities have therefore had to bring ships such as armed freighters and reserve ships into active service.


Mars Class Battlecruiser - 270
Fleet Admiral - 50

Tyrant - 185
45cm Upgrade - 10

Dauntless (Torpedo) - 110
Dauntless (Torpedo) - 110

Dauntless (Lance) - 110


Rogue Trader Reserves

Heavy Transport - 40pts
6 Armed Freighters - 120pts

TOTAL SO FAR - 1005pts

I could include more Rogue Trader ships in the form of a Carnage, but that would force me to take a Veteran Rogue Trader. I already have the ship though so it would be easiest.

Alternatively I could buy another box of cruisers or use the two old Lunar class cruisers I have lying around somewhere. I think I would quite like to include a Dictator though for a few more launch bays.

It would also be cool to include some Space Marines, however like i've posted elsewhere the only way to do this is to use the Armageddon list which stops me using dauntless'.

Cheers

Pembo
« Last Edit: November 01, 2011, 11:55:50 AM by Pembo »

Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2011, 02:11:28 PM »
You already need a vrt as you have 2 squadrons of transports.

Alternative w/armageddon fleet list

Mars w/fleet commander   320
Dictator                              220
Tyrant w/upgrade              195

SM Strike Cruiser                145
SM Strike Cruiser                145

RT Lance Dauntless            125
RT Armed Freghters (6)      120

Reserve Dauntless w/ torp 110
Reserve Dauntless w/ torp 110

1490 pts
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Offline horizon

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2011, 02:20:52 PM »
But, Andrew, that list does not conform to the background of Pembo (isolated sector and all). ;)

Pembo,
Instead of Dauntless I think it would be better to have one Endeavour to represent the rag-tag effect of such locations.
Plus more escorts!

Capital ships are rare. Backwater systems are patrolled by one Frigate once a year so to say.

So:
Mars (or Dictator or Dominion if opponent agrees)
Tyrant
Dauntless
Endeavour
Swords

Offline Pembo

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2011, 02:46:42 PM »
You already need a vrt as you have 2 squadrons of transports.

Actually the Heavy Freighter counts as a capital ship when taken as allies, so I only have one capital ship and one squadron of freighters  ;)

I like the fleet list you've come up with, allows me to take some strike cruisers too  :D

But, Andrew, that list does not conform to the background of Pembo (isolated sector and all). ;)

I know I said it's a pretty isolated sector, but in the past i've always tried to field armes/fleets that have some background. However that's not really got me anywhere. I think Imperial, Rogue Trader and Space Marine vessels would help to represent whats around at the time, maybe the sector could be a bit less isolated, just not as vitally important as some sectors.

Instead of Dauntless I think it would be better to have one Endeavour to represent the rag-tag effect of such locations.

I know what you're saying, but when i've fielded endeavours in the past they've not really done as well as i'd hoped. I also like the strength 6 torps of the dauntless compared to the strength 4 torps of the Endeavour.

Thanks for your advice guys, its appreciated. I'll have to have a think about what I want to include in the fleet now.

Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2011, 03:10:25 PM »
If its for a campaign the next 500 pts needs to be escorts IMO to fit the fluff. I like the idea of the dictator and strike cruisers when he mentioned them as dictators are a prime choice for guarding merchant convoys and the strike cruisers represent a small SM force in the area, not unherd of. It would be even better if the two strike cruisers are represented as two different chapters. The Tyrant works too as they so often seem to get pushed to the back burner in favor of other line cruisers. Dauntless or Endeavour would work fluff wise, both are very common light cruisers, I also kinda like the idea of them asking sector command for reinforcements and getting two light cruisers. This shows that yes they understand the need for back up, but they still are not really worth sending line cruisers. The RT seem fine, I like the idea of a merchant convoy and its escorts being pressganged into service and upgraded with better weaponery. The one thing I really think doesn't fit is the Mars.
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Offline Pembo

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2011, 03:15:25 PM »
I like all of those ideas, spunds really good. If i get the strike cruisers i'll be sure to paint them up as different chapters.

Well the Mars is the Flagship of the sector commander, its not worth giving him a battleship so he has to make do with a battlecruiser.

OK, here's another idea.

Mars Class with Fleet Admiral - 320
Tyrant Class with upgrade - 195
Strike Cruiser - 145
Strike Cruiser - 145

Reserves
Daunless (Torpedo) - 110

Rogue Traders
Dauntless (Torpedo) - 125
Carnage - 195
Veteran Rogue Trader - 50

5 Armed Freighters - 100

5 Armed Freighters - 100

Total = 1485

I could give the carnage a Xenotech upgrade with the final 15pts, or swap out 5 of the frieghters and get a few escorts for 115pts.

Basically it gives me a long range element (Mars, Carnage, Tyrant) and a short range fast moving element (2 Strike Cruisers, 2 Dauntless')  Hopefully the 4 light cruisers would be able to overwhelm a cruiser in a turn or two. My main (and only) opponent at the moment is Chaos if that helps. He likes to include a battleship in 1500pts and lots of AC.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2011, 04:41:50 PM by Pembo »

Offline horizon

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2011, 06:42:37 PM »
oh lol,
Strike Cruisers are not what I reckon ships ending up in a 'little less' isolatoed backwater system. These are dedicated and precious ships. Furthermore Marines are not easily wasted to do this job.
Strike Cruisers do planetary assaults and such.

Or you need to create a good background story about it.

Endeavours & Dauntless are very different ships with different doctrines.

But hey, all your call ;)

Offline Mycen

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2011, 11:48:23 PM »
When I'm designing lists that represent isolated or backwater systems I like to use Exorcists for AC. Their fluff makes them perfect for the role, they're old, crappy ships that are basically left out in the wilderness. They also give you the AC that a Mars or Dictator would and the shooting of a Tyrant, (almost, anyway) whilst being more durable.

I agree with the escorts idea, you'd need to have lots of them to really show off that 'fringe system' feeling.


As far as the strike cruisers, Horizon, I entirely disagree. It is quite common to see Space Marine chapters (the newer, smaller ones especially) that have their home planets pretty far away from the more populated areas of the Imperium; they patrol their borders and, in turn, protect the 'borders' of the Imperium. Marines play a role in protecting worlds, not just attacking them, and if an Imperial planet near their fortress monastery was under attack it wouldn't normally be that hard to get the Marines to assist. It's not like he's including five strike cruisers and two battle barges, it's a predominantly Imperial Navy fleet, the marines are there to assist.

I do disagree with the idea about the strike cruisers being from different chapters though. I find it somewhat unlikely that there would be all that many chapters in close proximity in what is supposed to be an isolated backwater region.



Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2011, 01:52:15 AM »
Sorry I was going for chapters from other systems responding to a threat or request for aid when I said that. I do like your line of thinking also tho, very fitting for a fringe area.
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Offline Admiral_d_Artagnan

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2011, 03:21:25 AM »
As far as the strike cruisers, Horizon, I entirely disagree. It is quite common to see Space Marine chapters (the newer, smaller ones especially) that have their home planets pretty far away from the more populated areas of the Imperium; they patrol their borders and, in turn, protect the 'borders' of the Imperium. Marines play a role in protecting worlds, not just attacking them, and if an Imperial planet near their fortress monastery was under attack it wouldn't normally be that hard to get the Marines to assist. It's not like he's including five strike cruisers and two battle barges, it's a predominantly Imperial Navy fleet, the marines are there to assist.

What Horizon means is that Strike Cruisers are themselves a rare sight in the Imperium. The newer and smaller SM Chapters can make do with escort sized vessels (which depending on what you use can range from 800m to 1500m in length depending on which measurements you believe in).

Offline Mycen

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2011, 06:03:08 AM »
Well of course they're rare in the Imperium, but so are space battles in general. It is quite true that, in the grand scheme of things, space marine chapters positioned and sized in such a way that they would be assisting Imperial Navy fleets in battle are a rare sight. But compared to some of the other things in Battlefleet Gothic that we see on the tabletop without batting an eye, these chapters and situations are downright common. One example? Venerable battle barges.

Many Space Marines have no access to battle barges at all. Even the largest, longest lived, and most powerful chapters have less than a handful. Battle barges so old and powerful that they predate the formation of the chapter system and are still worth using in battle are beyond rare, as likely to be seen in an imperial space battle as an underhive ganger is to come face-to-face with an Eldar farseer. Compared to this, a Space Marine chapter lending a strike cruiser or two in a border engagement is practically commonplace.

In BFG we deal pretty much exclusively in rare events of the Warhammer 40,000 universe. Aside from named vessels like the Planet Killer, almost any fleet or scenario in BFG can be assumed to be something we can reasonably expect to see somewhere at some point; hardly in need of special justification.


Of course, I'm responding pretty doggedly about a non-issue, mainly because I think it's a fun discussion. I fully agree with you Horizon that he should have a good story behind it. It's always good to have fluff behind your fleet, the more in-depth the better! And stories like this, where they're on the 'frontiers' of the Imperium, are my particular favorite for BFG, they really bring out the 'age of sail IN SPACE' vibe that BFG is so good at evoking. I'd love to hear any other fluff you might come up with about your fleet Pembo! 8)


Offline Pembo

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2011, 09:23:49 AM »
Now i've got even more decisions to make!

Mycen, I like your idea of Marine assistance from a nearby chapter, however I also like AndrewChristlieb's idea of vessels from different chapters coming to assist as they were passing through the sector at the time.

Exorcist Grand Cruisers are a good idea, however that brings the other issue of getting marines and exorcist grand cruisers in the same fleet.

Basically it all comes down to this. I like my fleets to have background (hence my Rogue Trader fleet), however the Chaos player I usually go up against defeats them. He normally uses all cruisers and a battleship in 1500pts.

I'm prepared to purchase a few ships, which is why I was considering a pair of Strike Cruisers. At the moment I have models for:

Mars Class Battlecruiser
Lunar Class Cruiser
Tyrant Class Cruiser (Rogue Trader Cruiser)
2 Dauntless (Torpedo)
Dauntless (Lance)
Carnage Class Cruiser (Rogue Trader)
2 currently unusable chaos cruiser (each has a pair fo lances and a pair of WBs)
Heavy Freighter
12 Armed Freighters
2 Firestorm Frigates.

Now i've never really used escorts much because whenever I do they get shot to bits in a turn or possibly two.
As i've said earlier, i'm trying to represent a small imperial battlegroup thats being assisted by a Rogue Trader that's in the system as well as possibly Space Marine reinforcements.

What are people's suggestions? do I need to buy more ships? Or could I make a decent fleet with what i've got. As I said i'm usually fighting chaos.

Cheers

Pembo

Offline horizon

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2011, 09:31:01 AM »

Now i've never really used escorts much because whenever I do they get shot to bits in a turn or possibly two.
As i've said earlier, i'm trying to represent a small imperial battlegroup thats being assisted by a Rogue Trader that's in the system as well as possibly Space Marine reinforcements.

What are people's suggestions?
Learn to use escorts wisely. ;)

eg Not at the front, not on their own, behind the lines, tricky around the flank, etc

Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: Imperial Battlegroup Omega
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2011, 02:42:53 PM »
Agreed escorts come in 3 basic flavors. Support, heavy weps, ordnance or for IN sword, firestorm, cobra.
 Support work best coupled with a capitol ship, in you case the mars. They can easily destroy any escorts that are harassing her, intercept enemy ordnance coming her way, and provide direct fire support against any cruisers that come near her. They should always remain behind the ship they are protecting unless they are being used to intercept a wave of ordnance, or you have routed the enemy and are taking on targets of opportunity (crippled, disengageing, etc.)
 Heavy weapons are best for picking off weakened capitols. They should remain behind the gun line until you have meet the enemy, then either break with the gun line and stay behind them while supporting with direct fire, or breaking across the enemies gun line to attack targets of opportunity. They also work well as head hunters, flanking the enemy and taking on targets of opportunity preferably with a light cruiser as the point ship.
 Ordnance ships work like heavy weps for the most part, they are also good at laying down ordnance to deny an area of space and sniping torps and fighters. I prefer to keep them behind the line until the lines have meet, then run them across the enemy line and ctnh to unload their torpedoes into the enemies rear.
   
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