July 28, 2024, 11:24:21 AM

Author Topic: Torpedo and AC markers redux....  (Read 14258 times)

Offline lastspartacus

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1279
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2011, 12:18:50 PM »
This...makes me excited.

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2011, 03:03:12 AM »
Small update on this. I'd hoped to post pictures of the prints tonight, but it seems that UPS has failed yet again and the bits didn't show up today despite the tracking info promising they'd be here. Hopefully they will show up tomorrow. If all goes well I'll be adjusting everything on shapeways to print multiples of each stand rather than the single base I had in the file to test the print quality.
-Vaaish

Offline TheMaster42

  • Lurker
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2011, 07:23:52 AM »
I also am excited about this.  I'd buy sets.

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2011, 01:00:01 AM »
Ok, the markers came tonight and we have a bit of a mixed bag. Frosted Ultra Detail turned out quite spectacularly and I'm sure would paint up nicely for any of the markers.

The rest was a bit of a different story though as the following pic will show:


The top row is the frosted ultra detail. The middle is the same file printed with the white strong and flexible.
The last row is a slightly different file printed in white strong and flexible on the left and black detail on the right. I've also zoomed in on the WSF and frosted ultra detail to show just how grainy the WSF is. I'll be posting a pic of this properly painted up, but the result so far is that the dice tray work great, however the full 3d missiles just aren't showing the detail of the fins outside of the frosted ultra detail and are probably not worth pursuing as a printed object.

That leaves the flat marker which I personally prefer. In WSF it's a bit grainy for what I'd like although it's pretty cheap I'm still not happy with the quality so I may not release it in that material. That leave the black and white detail which both seem adequate and frosted ultra detail. Any thoughts?
-Vaaish

Offline lastspartacus

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1279
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2011, 01:05:08 AM »
They will show up much better with some painting and highlights, doncha think?

Whats the price tag on these babies?  I want some :)

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2011, 01:16:11 AM »
I assume they will, which is why I'm in the process of painting up the black detail and WSF flat markers as I type. If they turn out acceptably once painted then I'll offer the material. Shapeways has a minimum order of $25 USD, so I'm looking to cram in as may as I can. With the WSF, I got around 15 in there. With the detail materials I might be able to eek out a similar number but I'm not sure yet.
-Vaaish

Offline lastspartacus

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1279
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #21 on: September 14, 2011, 02:03:52 AM »
A question, what exactly is this shapeways thing?

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #22 on: September 14, 2011, 02:16:35 AM »
Shapeways is the company that prints the markers. I'm not going to be casting them myself, but shapeways does let me post them in a "store" so if you order shapeways print them off and ships them to you.
-Vaaish

Offline lastspartacus

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1279
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #23 on: September 14, 2011, 02:22:42 AM »
So you designed them on the site, or do you have to do the 3d work yourself?  Pretty sweet company.

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #24 on: September 14, 2011, 05:44:52 AM »
I did all the 3d work on them myself. They just print them and ship. Anyway, I did get a quick paint job on these tonight. I'd still like to adjust them a bit by highlighting the edges of the tokens, but here's the result on the important parts. The one to the far left is the Black Detail and the others are the white strong and flexible material. I almost think that they turned out well enough to allow the WSF material. You can still see the graineyness when you zoom in. It's also important to note the WSF material absorbs paint like crazy.

-Vaaish

Offline TheMaster42

  • Lurker
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2011, 09:37:01 AM »
I'm sold for several.  How much are we talking about here?

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2011, 03:03:16 PM »
I'm fairly positive that shapeways increased the cost of their materials again. I had figured that the detail materials would be around 35 for 15 and the white strong and flexible would be 25 for 15. The actual breakdown for cost is this:

15x White Strong and Flexible:  $26.93
15x Frosted Detail: $42.55
15x Black Detail: $44.50
15x White Detail: $44.36
15x Frosted Ultra Detail: $57.53

All prices are USD and include shipping.

Here's the link to the model for purchase:
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/vaaish

Just be warned that the WSF ones aren't as good of resolution. They work and paint up nice, but they don't look as good as the black detail materials. I'm going to be looking into ways of reducing the cost a bit too but I don't think there is much I can do since I'm already at the minimum wall thickness for the detail materials. I may be able to shave a bit off by beveling the top edge a bit but I don't think there will be any significant reductions.
-Vaaish

Offline TheMaster42

  • Lurker
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2011, 07:56:26 PM »
I forwarded the thread to my BFG friends, and one of them had the suggestion of making the torpedo shape etched, instead of relief - to lower the cost.

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2011, 08:42:09 PM »
That is a good thought, but having the torpedo etched is not possible for a couple of reasons. First, not so much a technical constraint as aesthetic, is that the point was to have raised detail on the token since it's easier for light to catch the edges on raise details than sunken. Technically though, making the relief sunken isn't going to save any material. I've actually hollowed out the entire underside of the base on the side with the missile relief to the very minimum wall thickness (you can sort of see this on the zoomed in view of the unpainted FUD). This was both to save cost and to allow the markers to stack flat with the relief fitting inside the base of the marker on top. To make the relief sunken rather than raised means that I'll have to fill in the underside and remove the material from the top which comes out to less material removed because the shape of the missile on the marker is less area than the rectangle I'm filling in to maintain the minimum wall thickness.

Basically where the problem comes in is this: The minimum wall thickness for the black and white detail materials is 1mm. That means I have to have at least 1mm of material under the bottom of the tray side and on top of the hollowed out section on the left or shapeways won't print them. In order to get that without killing the ability to actually hold the dice, I had to make the base 2.5mm thick.

Now, the other option was to build them only to print in the White Strong and Flexible and FUD materials. That reduces the tolerance to .7mm as the minumum wall thickness and means that I'm able to make the marker 2mm thick. In other words, to have the option for the Detail materials which are far better quality prints, I had to add .5mm of material to each marker. The end result being that 15 markers are around $26USD while 18 of the thinner markers are $25USD.

What this leaves for options is to attempt to save material somewhere else on the model and right now the only somewhere that hasn't been tweaked are the edges of the marker. I'm looking at adding a beveled edge around the outside which should save a bit of material compounded by each marker for what I hope will be significant savings. I'm also looking at making greater contrast in the levels on the relief to help fix some of the issues with the WSF material too which may make the option for the better materials less necessary especially if I can get it to 20 markers for 25USD which is the minimum dollar value for an order on shapeways. 
« Last Edit: September 14, 2011, 08:53:05 PM by Vaaish »
-Vaaish

Offline Vaaish

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 986
    • Digital Equinox
Re: Torpedo and AC markers redux....
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2011, 10:04:32 PM »
After further tweaks, I've put up a version limited to just the WSF, FUD, and FD materials. The price hasn't really changed, but I've managed to squeeze in 5 more markers than the previous set for a total of 20 markers which makes it about $1.34 per marker. Unfortunately, I won't be able to buy another test run but most of the tweaks made the detail more defined on the missile and added the beveled edge so there shouldn't be any printing issues. The link is the same as before.

http://www.shapeways.com/shops/vaaish
-Vaaish