Torpedo boats and others...

[deadly florist]

So I've just started to play BFG and we are using the rules that you guys have come up with, but I can't seem to find them, could somone point me to the final rules list as well as the flawed rules lists?

Also, i have gotten a chance to look at the rules, but I didn't see anything for the torpedo bombers that my ships had as an option, where would those be?

[Plaxor]

Hey DF. 'Flawed Ships' is my project, and you can find the link in my signature. I'm happy to see that word is getting around. They aren't finished yet, but will be in 2-3 months.

Otherwise official rules are available at both the GW website and at: https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzUyNjQzZTAtMDZiMS00ZjRlLWJjNzMtYTE5YmNjZjdjODQ1 Which contains the HA's work over the last year.

Torpedo Bombers are a generic upgrade that they implemented in Armada. They can be found in the Armada appendices document on the GW website. Basically any ship with launch bays can take them for 10 points per launch bay (Or 15 if you're Tau, Eldar, DE, or CWE). They aren't really anything that great, so I wouldn't worry too much about taking them.

[horizon]

Some love torp  bombers. I don't know why.

[RCgothic]

I would love torp bombers, but not at 10pts per point of strength. They're worth perhaps 5pts per 4 launch bays IMO.

[Valhallan]

if you play super torp heavy, they might be worth 5pnts per launch bay... though... with FS I always take them on my torpy exorcist!

[RCgothic]

According to Dauntless, 2Torps are equal to 1 Lance. 4Lances are equal to 8 torps. A Lunar replaces its 4 lances with launch bays that can launch 4 torpedo bombers and therefore 8 torps to become a Dictator for a premium of 30pts.

You gain significantly more fire arc and focus, but also a strong possibility of being intercepted and an RO check to do anything at all, but this is also already taken into account in the 30pt premium for regular launch bays - so far no justification for price hike.

Compared to stardard bombers against T2 6+/5+, an 8 torp salvo rolls 7D6 after turrets against facing armour and subsequent targets. whilst the bombers roll 5D6 against weakest armour. This would seem to justify a 12pt price hike, but torp bombers are also easier to intercept as they cannot shotgun - they may only be converted at the start of a subsequent ordnance phase.

Summary:
In absolute power terms, relative to ship based weaponry, there's no reason for a price hike.
In comparison to regular bombers, there may be an argument depending on target type for 5pts per pair of launch bays.

[Zhukov]

You gain significantly more fire arc and focus, but also a strong possibility of being intercepted and an RO check to do anything at all, but this is also already taken into account in the 30pt premium for regular launch bays - so far no justification for price hike.

Compared to stardard bombers against T2 6+/5+, an 8 torp salvo rolls 7D6 after turrets against facing armour and subsequent targets. whilst the bombers roll 5D6 against weakest armour. This would seem to justify a 12pt price hike, but torp bombers are also easier to intercept as they cannot shotgun - they may only be converted at the start of a subsequent ordnance phase.

RC,

Don't forget, in the 2010 FAQ, torpedo bombers may attack like normal bombers if they choose to. And what do you mean they cannot "shotgun"?

-Zhukov

[Valhallan]

'shotgun'... guessing its where you fire off torps point blank so they can't be intercepted [except by CAP]. Tbombers can't do it cuz you have to wait 1 ordy phase before turning them into torp salvos

[RCgothic]

RC,

Don't forget, in the 2010 FAQ, torpedo bombers may attack like normal bombers if they choose to.

Well that's another thing I strongly disagree with in terms of the direction of the FAQ. Why then have regular bombers? These are just super-bombers with no drawback. I liked the distinction.

[lastspartacus]

Torp bombers can also hit multiple ships.

[Zhukov]

Why then have regular bombers? These are just super-bombers with no drawback.

Wait, there is a drawback. You need to spend points to get the super-bombers. Makes sense to me.

-Zhukov

[Browncoat(USA)]

Some love torp  bombers. I don't know why.

Maybe to give chaos a greater level of access to torps?  IDK, never used them.  Torps are for imperials and aliens. 

Blood for the Blood God!

[Sigoroth]

I agree with RCG on all points. TBs should not count as regular bombers, nor should they cost so much. To extend on what RCG has already offered I see no reason for the exhorbitant price hike for Eldar TBs either. You gain Eldar torps rather than normal torps, but lose an Eldar bomber rather than a normal bomber. For the Tau you gain a bit more (20-40cm movement torps) but surely this advantage is worth nowhere near 5 pts per bay. If you paid a flat +5 points over and above what other races paid per ship that would be enough.

If I were to allow a torp bomber to directly attack a ship at all, it would not be as a bomber. I would simply allow it to attack with its 2 torps. However, any turret hit would take out a bomber rather than a single torp. So if a wave of 4 TBs attacked a 3 turret target and 2 turrets hit then 4 torps would attack against facing armour. I wouldn't place the torps either when attacking like this, so misses wouldn't have a chance to go on to other ships.