The comparison made to the Overlord is that the firepower isn’t much better for being more expensive. The point is that first of all, the firepower IS better
Nate, thanks for the updates and explanations it helps immensely! I have to say though that this is flawed. If you were comparing the pre-FAQ2010 Overlord then you would be quite right, but as Sig pointed out with the targeting matrix, the overlord has functionally the same firepower as the flying bomb that is the mercury. With options like the Dominion and Victory, it even makes sense to take the armageddon as a second battle cruiser choice or reserve in an overlord which fits bakka well using it's targeting matrix AND already having the option to upgrade it's turrets to 3.
On admech. Hows does this work for opening more CB clots? If you take say an admech gothic, it fills one CB slot in the bakka fleet but since admech ships aren't battlecruisers does it count as one cruiser for opening a second CB slot? In orther words would something like this be legal, ignoring points for the time being:
Siluria
Siluria
Admech Gothic
Dominator
Admech Gothic
Dominator
Armageddon
Jovian
Hi Vaaish!
![Smiley :)](http://www.specialist-arms.com/forum/Smileys/default/smiley.gif)
The Bakka fleet list states the following:
In a Bakka fleet list, cruisers from the Adeptus Mechanicus fleet list may be taken in place of and in the same manner as Imperial Navy battlecruisers.The intent is that AdMech cruisers count as battlecruisers in all respects. To make this clearer, we will change the following to state:
In a Bakka fleet list, cruisers from the Adeptus Mechanicus fleet list may be taken instead of and in the same manner as Imperial Navy battlecruisers, counting as battlecruisers against any fleet limits in all respects.As such, your fleet list is two battlecruisers too heavy. Even though you can take one reserve cruiser/battlecruiser/etc. for every three cruisers in the fleet, you still need two cruisers per battlecruiser. Now if you wanted to cheese out on min-max carriers, this would actually be legal:
Siluria
Siluria
Admech Dictator
Dominator
Dominator
Admech Dictator
Reserve Dictator
Reserve Dictator
This however would be quite an expensive fleet, and reserve vessels don’t get the cheap +1 turret so while you would have a lot more ordnance than a typical Bakka fleet, this would also lose out on a lot of the benefits of playing a Bakka fleet as well. For carriers, It also can still be swamped by a plain-vanilla Imperial Navy fleet: AdMech cruisers legally count as reserves for ANY Imperial Navy fleet, and a plain-vanilla IN fleet can bring two more Dictators (for the two Dominators) than this fleet can bring for very little difference in total price
This ALSO doesn't take into account that AdMech cruisers aren’t really true battlecruisers despite their price so a plain-vanilla IN fleet can square against this with four Dictators and two Mars in the BC slots, and even then the point costs would not be that far apart.
As for the Mercury, the arguments are beginning to get circular. Everyone clamored to bring the Overlord price down so we did. Then everyone used it as a hook to drop the Armageddon so we did. NOW some are complaining the Mercury needs to drop in price because of these other ships. I understand and get the price issues so the HA’s discussed it and it happened.
Mention has been made that the Overlord is better than the Mercury because it can take the targeting matrix refit so the Mercury should be made cheaper. Firstly, the Overlord can only be taken as reserves in this fleet so comparing the Overlord to the Mercury is like apples and basketballs. Secondly, while the Overlord can take a targeting matrix, it costs +15 points, the same price as a Mercury without the NC. The turret argument doesn’t wash either- while both can get +1 turret, the Mercury gets it for +5 points, while it costs the Overlord twice that. Added together you get your pick between two “flavors†of Overlord: one that’s faster, or one that has more-accurate firepower. Again, in actual gameplay (which I suggest some people try), what makes one better than the other will come down to playing style.
The Mercury is a brand-new ship, and we would rather aim a bit high with the points than aim too low (see the Devastation). We’re not revisiting the Mercury anymore unless it is broken as far as fairness or rule mechanics go. Players are NOT being obligated to use this ship if they don’t like it. Some people like it, some people hate it. It isn’t the only ship in the game that suffers this problem, and that in and of itself doesn’t make it un-playable.