IA10

[Vaaish]

Unfortunately Sig, that's just not true. The FW tau list was official for years and not published under SG. Same goes with the rest of the FW line and 40k now that they removed the disclaimer. Good news is that none of this will likely show up very often and even then most of crazy stuff is one of ships.

[Sigoroth]

Unfortunately Sig, that's just not true. The FW tau list was official for years and not published under SG. Same goes with the rest of the FW line and 40k now that they removed the disclaimer. Good news is that none of this will likely show up very often and even then most of crazy stuff is one of ships.

You talking BFG Tau? Because then we're talking Kor'or'Vesh rules, and they were never official. It was always that players could use FW models as 'counts as' for the original Tau list. If you turned up to a tourney with rules printed by Forge World and not ratified by the SG or the HA then you'd be SOL.

[BaronIveagh]

Unfortunately Sig, that's just not true. The FW tau list was official for years and not published under SG. Same goes with the rest of the FW line and 40k now that they removed the disclaimer. Good news is that none of this will likely show up very often and even then most of crazy stuff is one of ships.

You talking BFG Tau? Because then we're talking Kor'or'Vesh rules, and they were never official. It was always that players could use FW models as 'counts as' for the original Tau list. If you turned up to a tourney with rules printed by Forge World and not ratified by the SG or the HA then you'd be SOL.

Um, Sig, admittedly, I'm not familiar with how current tourneys for BFG go, but I've already seen this argument lost for 40k with DKoK.  At the time that the Kor'O'Vesh was published, IA 3, IIRC, the books were still being published with the 'opponents consent' disclaimer.  Though, I also seem to recall someone mentioning that SG officially adopted it at some point. 

Hopefully the HA will FAQ IA 10 next...

[Vaaish]

You talking BFG Tau? Because then we're talking Kor'or'Vesh rules, and they were never official. It was always that players could use FW models as 'counts as' for the original Tau list. If you turned up to a tourney with rules printed by Forge World and not ratified by the SG or the HA then you'd be SOL.

Yes BFG tau. Those rules were available on the FW site for some time and I've always seen them accepted as official rules for the FW tau fleet.

[Plaxor]

So if 'Darkling Engines' were an upgrade in the rogue trader world (akin to the others available to them) how much would it cost?

[BaronIveagh]

So if 'Darkling Engines' were an upgrade in the rogue trader world (akin to the others available to them) how much would it cost?

Hard to say without a description, but I'd limit it as archeotech/Xenotech and have it give a penalty to ballistic and detection tests against the ship.  It would definitly be a 'Unique' upgrade to limit the parties ability to buy one.

Or did you mean the BFG Rogue Trader list?

[Plaxor]

Yes. Basically a 6+ BFI save.

[BaronIveagh]

Yes. Basically a 6+ BFI save.

Ahh, see, I was interpreting what we know as it begin a separate save like necrons. 

[lordgoober]

Well,  we will see how these potentially function in a tournament format because I have decided to allow the SHIPS into the Adepticon tournament.  I hope I haven't made a huge mistake with this.

[Sigoroth]

Yes BFG tau. Those rules were available on the FW site for some time and I've always seen them accepted as official rules for the FW tau fleet.

If they weren't on the then SG resource page then they weren't official. If they were then that means they were ratified by SG. Just because it comes out in FW or WD or black library or whatever doesn't mean it's official. In fact, BFG used to have even more stringent rules about what was and wasn't official, though that has slipped by the wayside somewhat. For it to be official it had to make it to a SG publication with the tag line "New Rule". Other articles published had "Experimental House Rule". Things were only made official after feedback from the fans was taken.

Now the process is less stringent and active from GWs side and I could well imagine them, if they were asked, to say "yeah, sure, whatever FW does is official", but it hasn't been the practice so far, and I see no reason to adopt that sort of practice now. Unless some nob from SG stamps it official then it's not. This doesn't have to be a bald statement of course, it could be something as simple as hosting a pdf of the FW rules along with the other BFG pdfs.

As for FW not bothering with the "with opponents permission" by-line, I think that has more to do with them realising that they make terrible rules, and that no one takes them seriously anyway. I personally think that with this latest effort they're trying to deliberately provoke us. They're wondering just how much crap we'll tolerate.

Um, Sig, admittedly, I'm not familiar with how current tourneys for BFG go, but I've already seen this argument lost for 40k with DKoK.  At the time that the Kor'O'Vesh was published, IA 3, IIRC, the books were still being published with the 'opponents consent' disclaimer.  Though, I also seem to recall someone mentioning that SG officially adopted it at some point.  

Hopefully the HA will FAQ IA 10 next...

No, iirc SG didn't ratify the FW list as official. What they did do was remove their own list for the FW models in deference to IA3 being released. This was, of course, pure marketing. It doesn't do to tell people that the information in that terribly terribly expensive book is junk, so you may as well not buy it. The "counts as" rule was still in effect up till the recent(ish) release of SGs Kor'or'vesh.

Btw, what is DKoK? Death Korp of Krieg? (Shouldn't that be "Corp"?) Been a while since I've played 40k. Which is a different kettle of fish mind you, they get their "official" rules from a number of different sources. Much harder to keep straight what's what in 40k.

[Sigoroth]

Well,  we will see how these potentially function in a tournament format because I have decided to allow the SHIPS into the Adepticon tournament.  I hope I haven't made a huge mistake with this.

Wait, what? You're allowing the FW rules? Of course you're making a huge mistake. That's a given. It's FW rules. There isn't even a passing attempt at sanity. Well, OK, the strike cruiser variant seems only a little excessive. The same people that came up with those ridiculous fleet lists came up with those ships ... That should be enough of a turn off rigth there.

[Zelnik]

Sig, do you see that little symbol down at the bottom of the forgeworld site?

you know what that says? games workshop.

It's part of GW, that means it's rules are viable in official play. You can say "no your a jerk" to forgeworld users, but your more likely to play fewer games.

You can split hairs about it, but they are way more official then our opinions and feelings. They are even more official then the High admiralty. Do I like all their rules? no. Occasionally they come up with something pure gold (XV-9's and the tau crisis suits), and sometimes they are "flying to potato" stupid. 

[BaronIveagh]

You can split hairs about it, but they are way more official then our opinions and feelings. They are even more official then the High admiralty. Do I like all their rules? no. Occasionally they come up with something pure gold (XV-9's and the tau crisis suits), and sometimes they are "flying to potato" stupid. 

Sorry, a pal of mine once had a webcomic called attack of the flying potato.  And when we say stupid, we mean Land Raider Achilles stupid. 

Wait, what? You're allowing the FW rules? Of course you're making a huge mistake. That's a given. It's FW rules. There isn't even a passing attempt at sanity. Well, OK, the strike cruiser variant seems only a little excessive. The same people that came up with those ridiculous fleet lists came up with those ships ... That should be enough of a turn off rigth there.

I doubt we'll see Raptorius Rex win anything other then maybe the convoy run, unstoppable juggernaut that it is, it still can only move in a steight line, unless it uses rok movement rules.  I do like the weird ranges on some of them (since they will throw a lot of people off)

Some tourneys for 40k have always allowed FW, mostly due to SoB and Tau.  GW has been slowly blurring the difference between FW and everything else over the last edition (see Codex IG for FW spewing forth in great gouts.  The only thing they didn't make official from IA 1 was auto cannon chimeras and the rather redundant laser destroyer. 

[Valhallan]

isn't nates CPF tau fleet done? it doesn't say draft. I think that would mean its official (its got a funny number and everything).

don't get me started on autocannon chimeras. that's supposed to be executioner territory. its a transport for crying out loud.

[BaronIveagh]

isn't nates CPF tau fleet done? it doesn't say draft. I think that would mean its official (its got a funny number and everything).

don't get me started on autocannon chimeras. that's supposed to be executioner territory. its a transport for crying out loud.

What does a plasma cannon have to do with a autocannon?  I think you mean exterminator.


And, frankly 'transport' does not mean 'unarmed'  even in BFG...  look at the Razorback...  or the Devilfish!