Nova Cannon limitations

[horizon]

Nah, it is to weak currently. Ha!

[Plaxor]

It's just weak when you figure out the vessels true weakness, a lack of torpedoes.

[lastspartacus]

90cm-0cm is ultimately much better for the NC than 150cm-30cm, dunno why any of the pro power-NC would mind it. 

I've had  bit of a reversal in my NC feelings.  Due to their rare nature, theres no problem in somehow limiting the NC, and gives Admech more personality.

At the same time, in that case, I believe the NC should be more powerful in that  case, so it would function better in singles.

Say take current NC rules, except 2d6 scatter always, and D3 damage from template, rather than 1.

[horizon]

Say LS, what?

I don't think your last idea is a good NC solution.

And why are you so against 30-150cm? I think it is what makes the NC a NC.

[commander]

Well, maybe the armageddon gun must also be discussed, as it causes the same D6 damage, up to 90 cm, to all ships in the line of fire. 

As for the NC, it's a very powerful weapon by its fluff, so keep it that way.
No limits unless it's made more accurate (less deviation/scatter).

[lastspartacus]

I playtested my RS Orks in a 2000 point game vs an admech list, with Omnissiahs Victory, 3 nova-gifted lunars, and 4 endeavors, all tricked out with advanced weapons refit.  Yes, using the version where you can buy the refits.  Rounded out with 6 or so Falchions.

Point is, one thing we tested was a certain kind of nova cannon.

D6 if hole is on stem.  D3 if any part of blast touches any part of base.  10cm-120cm range.  And I believe 25 or 30 points rather than 20 point upgrade.  Limit of no more than half capital ships in the fleet having one, though that didn't come into effect as we agreed AdMech would ignore this.

Not a single direct hit on about 10 shots (!?) but it still did a noticable amount of damage to my fleet, as well as every damn shot scattering ahead of me and bogging me down.

The intent of this was to make Novas quite acceptable in singles, but pricey enough an increase to want to keep torpedoes.  I think it went well.
Thoughts?

[Vaaish]

Did you AAF to him or just mosey on over through the hail of NC shells? Without a good batrep we really can't post any thoughts. Your definition of noticeable damage might be one hit or three and there's no indication of your fleet. Regardless, I believe the discussion on the NC ended after several battlereports showed evidence that AAF towards a NC fleet almost always resulted in the NC fleet folding. That said, I don't see any justification for making the thing both weaker AND more expensive.

[Plaxor]

Yes LS. You shouldn't mosey through the fire.

Also the strategy against nova cannons is quite different than not. You want to bring the IN ships together rather than separate them, also if you have long ranged firepower you want to focus them on any ships that could potentially still fire their NC, as they can't fire whilst braced.

[lastspartacus]

Maybe you are missing something, It was a test of a stronger nova cannon, to make single novas more useful.
Nowhere did I say anything about overpowered nova cannons, I think you assumed rather than read the post.

I did forget one part, so I will relist it.

Normal targetting with scatterdice mechanic.  Always 2d6 scatter, regardless of range.  Hole on stem is D6 damage. If any part of the blast touches any part of a base, that vessel takes D3 damage.  10-120cm range.

I don't have a full battle report.  I was going on AAF when I wasn't bracing.  It led me to questioning if the 2d6 for orks wasn't simply too small, since I found myself only gaining enough extra movement to counter the slowdown from blast markers.  
It was a planetary assault mission, me as the attacker.

[Plaxor]

Planetary assault + NC defenders= Teh suxxor.

[lastspartacus]

It did seem to be

[Plaxor]

Nova cannons are a lot better in missions like that, where it's a long way to go. Means they will usually get double the number of shots with them they would normally.

In missions like the convoy they usually do very poorly.

Normal games (i.e. just kill your opponent) they usually do worse than torps would. It's only the special exception that in long range games that they do exceptionally well.

I think that in blockade run they would do well too, as the defender would be able to use his ships to attack from all three deployment sections.

[Vaaish]

Always 2d6 scatter, regardless of range.

You didn't include that in your original post. D3 damage on touching the template and loss of 30cm range is a far cry weaker than d6 damage for the hole anywhere on the base and 150cm range. 2d6 scatter at all range bands only helps the NC out past 60cm. It makes it worse since you roll an extra d6 close in and worse than the original rules mid range with the 2d6 scatter since you gain a slightly larger margin to still do more than one hit but lose 3 potential damage.

That makes it a weaker NC than it currently is.

[Sigoroth]

Always 2d6 scatter, regardless of range.

You didn't include that in your original post. D3 damage on touching the template and loss of 30cm range is a far cry weaker than d6 damage for the hole anywhere on the base and 150cm range. 2d6 scatter at all range bands only helps the NC out past 60cm. It makes it worse since you roll an extra d6 close in and worse than the original rules mid range with the 2d6 scatter since you gain a slightly larger margin to still do more than one hit but lose 3 potential damage.

That makes it a weaker NC than it currently is.

Actually it makes it stronger. The last 30cm of range is rarely used. However this version has a minimum range of only 10cm, meaning it will be usable the vast majority of the time, even in close (though still unlikely to scatter back on the firing ship). As for the D3, he meant that the hole still did D6 damage, but if the hole missed and the template still hit it would do D3 damage instead of 1 damage. Meaning that an indirect hit still has a 1 in 3 chance of doing damage through the shields.

[Vaaish]

As for the D3, he meant that the hole still did D6 damage, but if the hole missed and the template still hit it would do D3 damage instead of 1 damage. Meaning that an indirect hit still has a 1 in 3 chance of doing damage through the shields.

I was pretty sure he meant the hole had to be over the stem to get D6 hits and anything else just gives d3. If the hole gives d6 hits over the base too then, yes it is a more powerful version of the NC.