Space Marines - Redesign/Rules Development

[Mazila]

Horizon, modefier for BM is checked for both players.

Lunar VS Strike

For lunar Strike is the enemy and for Strike Lunar is!

If lunar has a BM in contact then they both have it. This is the way it works as per current ruling, same way as massed turrets.

[horizon]

Horizon, modefier for BM is checked for both players.

Lunar VS Strike

For lunar Strike is the enemy and for Strike Lunar is!

If lunar has a BM in contact then they both have it. This is the way it works as per current ruling, same way as massed turrets.

Depends on how you read the rule.

No. Note the wording in the Boarding Modifier table. If the Enemy ship has Blast Markers in contact. The boarding vessel is not affected here. Although I do see where there might be a problem with the wording of the BM rules. Would be best to have the HA address it definitively.

Lunar has marker on it, thus Lunar is affected I'd say.

edit: I mean, if both would be affected why on earth add the modifier?

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

I don't told a word about 40 game. I told only about books that produce Black Library and about some stories printed in codicies!

And You know, BFG is ABOUT SPACECOMBAT OF 40 000 millennium. So i don't understand why you os eager to separate it from WH 40k !

I don't want to just separate it. I do want you to pick and choose which stuff you present as proof because frankly, I question a lot of the stuff which comes out from the Black library. Even the Space Wolves had a hell of a time in their boarding action in one of their books. And really, all those books you mention are biased depending on who the book is about. If it's a book about SM, they're gods and they win against everything! If about Chaos SM, they're demons and win against everything. If Eldar, they're supreme beings and they win against everything. Are you seeing the picture? Heck, a book about Ratlings would probably see them win against everything.

[Atog]

Of course my mojo-dojo not so big to allow me bring fresh sm cruiser that not rolled for reload ordnance or all ahead full to crippled  enemy ship!  

And I don't believe that it's common to get +3(4) for boarding, no matter you say.

And according faq both ships supper of blastmarker in a BC with one of them.
  

[RCgothic]

In cramped corridors, perhaps 10 Naval armsmen can bring weapons to bear against 5 space marines. Those space marines have at least a 5-1 advantage all the time they are fighting. Sure, 60k vs 100 is going to be a short fight on an open battleground, but Corridors are where SMs excel.

[Sigoroth]

You know, Space Marines ARE masters of close quarter battles. Many books , articles, funstuff  says that very small space marines squad can overcome thunderous amount of enemy troops.   

Yeah, but some of the fluff describes SMs as being able to slaughter a million giants armed only with a broken toothpick. It's retarded.

But what we have here, in BFG game? SM don't good at CQB at all!

 In most cases they don't have any bonuses at all! Because  strike cruisers are light and it's damn hard to bring it to boarding  unharmed.   And even if I made so, what will I have? +1 to roll?!?!? Is it glorious angels of death feared around all Human worlds? 

Lets consider typical boarding scene where sm strike cruiser tries to boar pirate dauntless
--Die heretics! In the name of Empraaaa!
--Wait maan, roll you die.
--We have no fear of your dies, we are Angels of Death! Oh wait... 2 vs 6 , ow shiiiiii....

Ah, so SMs should be unbeatable? What's wrong with the current scenario anyway? They attack a superior force and are still more likely to win. How is that underpowered?

Uh, the ship the SM is boarding most likely will have BM so that's +1 - thats 0 since blast marker counts as being all around so they both have it. Makes me feel you guys are lost in all those FAQ's from time to time.

Just because the defending ship has a BM in contact that doesn't mean that any ship touching it has a BM in contact. Only if the BM is actually touching the ship does it count as having a BM in contact. At which point it counts as being in contact all around (though this is stupid).

I am not taking into account crippled ships since Marines should be signifficantly better VS any opponent. The fact that SMSC has 6 hits negates that and makes it actually "safer" to shoot things instead of boarding.

SMs should not be better against any opponent. Tyranids and Orks are both strong close quarters combatants, as are Eldar with their shuriken weaponry and aspect warriors and CSM have always been as good. Remember we're not talking about a few marines onto a few undirected genestealers. We're talking about battle against an entire ship's crew. Several thousand at least. Even when outnumbered the SMs tend to have the advantage. This is good enough.

[Atog]

"Ah, so SMs should be unbeatable?"
Of course not.
They must have more chances to beat ordinary enemy. Because the likely will beat it than not. And SM must have more chances to stand against hard enemy like Orks or Khornates.

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

You still apply it but it will depend on who's turn it is I would say. If next turn, it's the opposing player's turn then the turrets would be applied to the SC.

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

Of course my mojo-dojo not so big to allow me bring fresh sm cruiser that not rolled for reload ordnance or all ahead full to crippled  enemy ship!  

And why not? If the target could be taken out by not going on said Special Orders, then do it. Bring on the mojos.

And I don't believe that it's common to get +3(4) for boarding, no matter you say.

And according faq both ships supper of blastmarker in a BC with one of them.
  

Yes, the FAQ says the BMs count as being all around but the rule I believe means that if the target vessel already has a BM then the boarding vessel will get a +1. Otherwise, as Horizon points out, why the granting of the +1 modifier? That all around contact just makes things more difficult.

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

"Ah, so SMs should be unbeatable?"
Of course not.
They must have more chances to beat ordinary enemy. Because the likely will beat it than not. And SM must have more chances to stand against hard enemy like Orks or Khornates.

+2 Boarding Modifier is not enough against IN which is the most ordinary enemy you can get? You actually think they should be better against Orks and Khornates, masters of boarding themselves?

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

In cramped corridors, perhaps 10 Naval armsmen can bring weapons to bear against 5 space marines. Those space marines have at least a 5-1 advantage all the time they are fighting. Sure, 60k vs 100 is going to be a short fight on an open battleground, but Corridors are where SMs excel.

Yeah and one or two kamikaze Orks or lunatic Chaos tainted chap with bombs strapped onto them should be able to clear them out easily. Orks can just fix the damage after. Chaos can just mutate it. Nids will just evolve the area. Necrons will self repair. Eldar can whip SM's butts easily in such a combat scenario. Only Tau and IN will probably be at the mercy of the SM.

[Sigoroth]

Again, I reiterate, and to be sure I can't believe there's actually confusion in this regard, the BM penalty only applies to ships that actually have a blast marker in contact. I have no idea how one could possibly consider otherwise. So just because you move into contact with a ship with a BM touching it, it does not mean that you're in contact with a BM.

[Mazila]

Again, I reiterate, and to be sure I can't believe there's actually confusion in this regard, the BM penalty only applies to ships that actually have a blast marker in contact. I have no idea how one could possibly consider otherwise. So just because you move into contact with a ship with a BM touching it, it does not mean that you're in contact with a BM.

Because you move into contact before boarding and only than you shoot it with another vesel. And this should work same way as massed turrets - BM counts as all around and effects all ships.

[Sigoroth]

Because you move into contact before boarding and only than you shoot it with another vesel. And this should work same way as massed turrets - BM counts as all around and effects all ships.

And why would you move your own BM to touch your own ships?

[horizon]

lolz

Anyway, now look what they did with the BM all around rule -> confuse people.