If you could make an Imperial ship legal, which one(s) would it be?

[lastspartacus]

Let me clarify on the chart as well.

Vanquisher: no opinion
Victory: no opinion
Delete Jovian: In another fleet list, its a cool ship.  Never ever in Bakka.
Torps on Mercury: A fast nova cannon ship is wierd, in an ugly sister way.  Torps, no reason not to.
+1 turret: Best solution.  Saying that makes it too similar to admech is false, for all the various reasons.
Ok, I'll list them, since I'm sure they apparently aren't obvious.  Dorsal lances.  Leadership.  Boarding.  Refits.  Nova cannons.  Specialist torpedoes.
Increased gunnery range. 

[Plaxor]

We could probably delete "bakka" and replace it with "Ham sandwich". 

That would probably be more useful/valued by the Gothic community.

Again, the utter unrelenting nature of his responses clearly suggests this is a pet project for at least ONE of the HA. I know this from experience in regards to the Diasporex Nomads list.

Is that your pet project?
Lets see... peoples pet project lists;

Horizon.... MMS
Xisor.... Demiurg
Plaxor.... Tartanus (and maelstrom fleets)

Quite a few in actuality.

The only issue with such an unrelenting attitude is that this fleet really has no place, nor is there a demand for it! We could be spending our time far more constructively by trying to produce a hero ship for the Dark Eldar or making nids more appealing to new players.

Yes, but Nate keeps saying the HA has its hands tied for a lot of things. He says they can't change armada fleets, but then they did SMs?

Dark Eldar in 'FS' (hopefully people know what that means now) have a CL and are able to upgrade their fleet commanders Torture to a GC (+2 hits, and can select an additional weapons system). Basically the closest that we could get to a GC without killing the fluff.

Nids... I think they're fine. I built a nid fleet at some point, then ebayed it... people will buy the converted models for double retail (out of gaunts and whatnot).

I've known two others who converted out a fleet. The nids are interesting enough so long as they have their upgrades. However they do get a bit OP. They are the easiest things to convert in the world.

Overall they just need a rebalance. Multiple upgrades should get more expensive as you buy them (I.e. extra spore cysts costing 10 for the first, and 15 for the second etc.)

'FS' ruleset fixes the immune to bombers problem. Which should help deal with the monstrosity.

[Zelnik]

Yes, I was the primary writer for the book of the Void.. it was the only book to come out of the ill fated BFG project too. 

The whole cast of those responsible can be seen in the pdf itself.

I think the big difference is that I actually got it done and released

Either way. Leave the comments about other fleets to their appropriate forums. 

That is a good point about the space marines. It would help if he told us the -exact- parameters of what we could, or could not change.

Also, a little impartiality would be nice too.

[Plaxor]

You mean Chronicles?

Ah. Yes. Things like this fall apart easily. Looks good.

[horizon]

Chronciles died. Now Maverick's email account is sending me spam...

MMS = Sigoroth + Horizon to be honest.

[Plaxor]

Yes, but I thought you adopted it from Sig?

The owner of the 'pet' is the one who holds the key to its changes.

I didn't think that Chonicles was that great of an idea... I mean... it was an interesting complaint that BFG doesn't cover everywhere. However it does allow for something similar to how privateer press does releases. If you aren't familiar, they do a new book every year with a few new models for each faction.


In BFG this idealogy could be done similarly. Every year you release a 'book' focusing on a different war. Even now it is set up for it, and has done it in the past. One of my hopes is to continue this trend through 'FS'.

Here:
BBB ---> Focuses on Gothic war
Armada ---> 13th black crusade/battle for armageddon
Nemesis*---> Pirate war in tempestus
Tartanus**---> Rogue Trader war near the Ghoul Stars

*unnoficial, and won't be fully part of FS
** Not written yet, and may be called something else. Likely release will be late summer/fall.

These could be continued upon. Lets say there could be a book based around the Battle for Maccrage, with an alternate nid fleet, Bakka, and even a Ultramarine fleet.

One note that I was thinking of, was that Eldar Heroes in FS will make reserve corsair/cwe ships not count as reserves when taken in either fleet. Meaning that they wouldn't get the -1 ld, but that's for another place.

[Sigoroth]

All right Zelnik, but one question.... what color is 'with a vengeance'?

I get the feeling it's teal, as that is what Sig always uses. Everything he says is 'with vengeance'.

Lol (with a vengeance).

We could probably delete "bakka" and replace it with "Ham sandwich". 

Wow. I have no idea why this hadn't been thought of before. It's brilliant. Mmmm. Hammmm.

[horizon]

Well,
Sigoroth's main idea, I made the pdf. We developed it further. After v1.3 iirc Sigoroth was less present on the net so I asked if I could take it all over (thus without discussing changes with him first as he had last say). He was cool with that.
From v1.8 on Sigoroth did keep commenting on it and all and I still value his input higher then others on it. Not because he is right persé, but it are "his" rules in a way. heheh.



Chronicles failed because of the megalomaniac personality of the project leader. In the time Reg did it the project was already lost (everyone dropped out).

The inititial idea was great. Back on port maw Maverick started the Segmentum Tempestus idea. A book dealing with the war within one sector. Lot of people worked in. Lot of work done, Vaais did main layout stuff and all. Most/everyone agreed on main story line. Alas Maverick scracthed things numerous times. Then he completely removed the project... :/
Started chronicles. I kept warning him that it was too large in scale. Focus on a sector with a few factions is much better,

Alas...


warning.
yes Ham Sanwich is cool. It has my vote as well.

[Plaxor]

You build in pieces. Yes... Megalomania... I too understand this wanting to do more than you can handle.

Simplicity, steal other peoples work and include it in your own set of rules! Muahahahaha!

Updated the list to account for proposition 'Ham Sandwich'.

[RCgothic]

Delete FDTs: Delete.
Vanquisher 300 (or less) pts: 290 with +5 speed, 280 otherwise. Either way, that's a yes.
Victory 330 pts: Yup. It has less firepower than the Retribution overall, and a more conflicted role.
Delete Jovian: Also Delete with a Vengeance.
Add Dominion: I'm actually indifferent.
Vanquisher 20cm speed: Hell yes. If that means all 45cm range, so be it.
+1 Turrets (possible increased cost): Yup.

Delete Victory: Nope.
Vanquisher somewhere else: Indifferent.
Delete Mercury: With a vengeance. +5cm speed is no compensation for its awful firepower, conflicted role and horrible firebomb rules.

Add Ignus: Indifferent.

Ham Sandwich: Come on guys, let's take this seriously. Nope.

[Plaxor]

Lol, 'Ham Sandwich' is something to see if Nate is listening. He hasn't been around in a while.

[RCgothic]

I hope the HA's don't take threads like this where we really don't like their list to heart.

Apart from pointing out some slightly vague wording, I had nothing bad to say about the new ork list at all! Seemed really awesome.

[Zelnik]

I hope they understand that too. I love all the other lists, BUT this one.

[Plaxor]

I like the SM, Tau, and Rogue Trader list (actually love the RTs)

Don't like this one or the chaos one....

The Ork one is just.... radically different from anything. I never liked the idea of clans affecting actual ship performance. The only thing that should be different about the clans is preference in what they purchase. I mean we don't have rules for Chaos Legions or SM chapters!

Alas, it's an all right document, just confusing and built adding expensive upgrades to an already poor fleet.

The Inquisition one is a good idea. I just think that they went too complicated with it. It makes it quite hard to play with most of the upgrades in one off games. Like Daemonhunters/witchunters in 40k, where over half the upgrades are useless unless you're playing against psykers or chaos or daemons or an army from 8 years ago....

[Valhallan]

BF bakka will make a great fluff fleet for anyone (like me) who's gonna GM a bfg game. and maybe fun for throwaway games.

I already ate the ham sandwich, so case closed.

Battlefleet Ultramar sounds fun. ac, NC, fleet specific nids. ugly dudes in baby blue pretending they're tough...