If you could make a Chaos ship legal, which one(s) would it be?

[lastspartacus]

carnage is great.  But lances at range are worth more than usual, due to the column shift on batteries.

2 Murders and an Acheron is, for the same points, a far nastier combo than 3 Carnages.

[horizon]

But the Murder is prow on or abeam.
The Carnage is just abeam.

Yes, prow on the Murders 2 lances will be better then the 6 batteries on the Carnage above 30cm.
However there is no need for the Carnage to go prow on. It goes abeam, has 10 batteries at 60cm and 16cm at 45 (compared to 10 from the Murder).
Abeam is harder to hit then prow on.

2 Murders and an Acheron have no synergy. The Acheron is wasted prow on.

Given 3 Murders and a Hades prow on are awesome prow on above 45cm. Just killing.

Consider the following mutual supporting Chaos fleet and see how it works and flows together in combat doctrine:

Desolator
2x Devestation
2x Carnage
2x Acheron

[lastspartacus]

Bah.  Everytime I said Acheron in the last couple posts, I meant Hades.

[horizon]

Well, from now on: Acheron > Hades in an abeam fleet and Hades > Acheron in a prow on fleet.

[lastspartacus]

Right.  Let me rephrase.  For the same points, I find 2 murders and hades to be more deadly than 3 carnages.

[horizon]

2 Murders and a Hades :
prow on 8 Lances @ 60cm
Broadside 30 batteries + 2 lances @ 45cm

3 Carnages :
prow on 18 batteries @ 60cm
Broadside 30 batteries & 60cm
Broadside 48 batteries & 45cm

So at 60cm the Murders/Hades should go prow on to be full effect. Prow on means enemies can hit you easier.
So at 60cm Carnages should go abeam to be full effect. Abeam means the enemy has difficulty hitting you.

As said, it is what your tactical play is.

Under 30cm the Carnages will eat the Murders/Hades in a broadside duel.

[lastspartacus]

Hmm, you are indeed right about the advantage carnages have against weapon batteries. 
All I can say for the murder/hades config is that I find it much easier to always bring their weapons to bear when closing.  In general, its easier to lock on, and get the maximum effect.  All im saying is, murders definately dont suck.  They are however, a ship that you should never take on its own, and a ship thats awesome in multiples.  Theres a few of those in this game.

[Zhukov]

Or two Murder variants and a Hades looks like this:

Prow on 8 Lances @ 60cm
Broadside 18 Batteries + 6 Lances @ 45cm

I <3 the Murder variant. Engages enemies better in broadside duals above 30cm than the standard Murder, IMO.

-Zhukov
 
EDIT: For those that use the Executor as a demonship, what does the rest of your 1500 pt list look like? Just curious.

[Sigoroth]

On the Executor I find them a nice support ship. They're a Gothic without the torps or armour, but with stronger broadsides (a little extra range) and extra hits, shields & turrets for only +30 pts. Sure it doesn't have much firepower for a 4 hardpoint broadside, and has no dorsal or prow weaponry, but for its cost it's not too bad.

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

I don't know why people don't like the Executor as well. I like it myself. It's the Retaliator that I can't stand. The Avenger should actually only cost in the neighborhood of 180 points. If that was it's price then people would bring it more often.

[Zhukov]

But why choose an Executor over an Acheron? The Acheron has advantages in: range, firepower, and speed. Not to mention, it fits in the Chaos list better.

Avenger 180? Don't agree because of the Dominator and Tyrant being 180 and that is certainly not the same ship.

Retaliators are terrible. The Styx and the Devastation perform its duty on a much better scale. To be honest, I feel the Retaliator and Exorcist need to be switched.

-Zhukov

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

Executor has advantage in HP and Shields which are no small thing. It all depends on your needs.

[Sigoroth]

But why choose an Executor over an Acheron? The Acheron has advantages in: range, firepower, and speed. Not to mention, it fits in the Chaos list better.

Er, no. Acheron has advantage in range and speed, not firepower. The most you can get out of an Acheron is 4L+6WB focused, which is equivalent to the Executor's broadside of 6L. However, the Executor can put out that firepower on each side. It has +4L offside firepower. If you get inside the enemy line you're putting out 12 lances of firepower. With Lock On you could potentially drop the shields of 2 battleships clearing the way for your fleet to fire unimpeded (note: this is of course dependant on using the old line of fire rule regarding BMs, otherwise you'd just use it to add extra fire after WBs have been shot).

Sure, the Acheron has +15cm range on the Executor and is faster. The Executor has +2 hits and +1 shield. This means that to be crippled in 1 turn it requires 2 extra hits, 3 if braced. Over the course of multiple turns it'll soak an extra hit each time compared to the Acheron, which adds up. When crippled it still retains reasonable firepower (75% of a Gothic each side) and has 2 shields, meaning it can soak twice the firepower of an Acheron and still have 1 more hit. Much more survivable.

As for fitting the Chaos list, I suppose that's why people take the Executor as a Deamonship, though those rules are almost unplayable as far as I'm concerned.

[Admiral_d_Artagnan]

Yup. Daemonship rules need revamping. Pun intended. 

[Zhukov]

@Sig:

Haha a game with two battleships..... Never had a game that big before... lol

As I get the idea the Executor is survivable, it's also an avoidable ship due to it's low range and slow speed. The fact that players here are saying they only take it as a deamonship is proof to this! Also, the opposite broadside bit. I see what your saying on having two broadsides but, personally, I wouldn't send my flag ship into the heart of an enemy fleet. At least it's not my style. I just see the Acheron having more flexibility on the game table compared to the Executor.

And I still want to see a list that has an Exorcist deamonship. I want to know what the rest of their fleet looks like.

-Zhukov