January 11, 2025, 05:47:52 PM

Author Topic: Why no archer units?  (Read 5498 times)

Offline CPBelt

  • Lurker
  • *
  • Posts: 8
    • Loc: Central Florida
    • A League of Ordinary Gamers
Why no archer units?
« on: November 17, 2014, 01:51:09 AM »
This may sound like a dumb question, but does anyone know why Warmaster orcs do not have archer units but WHFB has had them since at least 3rd edition? (Don't ask me why it has taken me this long to realize this!  :o)

Does anyone "unofficially" use archer units in their WM armies?

Offline Geep

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 900
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2014, 03:37:35 AM »
I don't know why, but I plan to build some :) There's a company that makes orc archers, but I don't like their look. Fortunately, they're thinner than 'proper' orcs, so I've bought some and they'll act as a base to sculpt on.

Offline Stormwind

  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 2750
  • Ben Sibbald | Newcastle, UK
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2014, 10:44:49 AM »
Orcs have rock lobbers, all their goblins get short range missile attacks, as do their wolf riders.

They can have 2 magicians per 1,000 points which cause anarchy with Gerroff and Gotcha! spells at minimal points cost.

Orcs do not have a shortage of ranged attack options. =-P

If Orcs suddenly get to have archers then my Chaos should be allowed to have Hellcannons!
My Personal & Modelling Blog >>http://theancienttrack.blogspot.co.uk/

Offline jchaos79

  • Moderator
  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 2530
    • Loc: Vigo, Galicia, Spain
    • Fortunes of war
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2014, 11:53:45 AM »
In my opinion it has to do more with the overall developtment of the warmaster lists than a simple translocation of WHFB to WM.

Making a "whatever" warmaster list is very simple, but making a balance and reliable list for WM is not easy at all. So this type of decision had to be made.

But if your question is: why drop archers? I do not know, maybe they have enough entries, or the use of goblins and wolf raiders with 15cm range weapons (as harash and skirmish army) could be annuled by proper archers.

Maybe bow is not a cultural weapon of the green people, so the abstraction of the army is going to close combat more than big units of disciplinated archers.

In warmaster you could not think as warriors, you have to think in military units. Can you imagine 300 orcs with bows waiting for a signal of the oficier to shoot. Can you imagine 300 orcs waiting until the enemy enter in the zone where the arrows could harm them. Remeber the use of bow as military unit is parabolic shoot not tense shoot, so the experience of the officier of the unit is important to measure the distance .

Does it means that orcs cannot use bows? I don¡t think so, I could imagine  two orcs with bows and poisoned arrows ambushing a Empire pistoliers while passing a bridge. Empire pistolier is carrying an important message to be given to elector count,. But This situations is about other game...

 

Offline Dranask1

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 87
  • Mark Foulds
    • Loc: Maidenhead, Berkshire.
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2014, 06:12:04 PM »
I play Orks.
Whilst I do not intend to offend I find I'm laughing at the idea of Goblins or Orks holding their fire until they can see the whites of their eyes!

The discipline required to make the English a country of archers included compulsory training on Sundays, all other games were banned.

I like my ork army with its limitations and don't approve of the goblins firing sticks at the enemy, the Orkish thing to do is get in close and personal. Feel you sword cleave bone and flesh and breathe in the fear of the pink weaklings.

Seriously though if every army had the same thing, where is the flavour?
« Last Edit: November 17, 2014, 06:13:37 PM by Dranask1 »
I play in Maidenhead and belong to
http://madgamers.co.uk/newforum/

New members always welcome!

Offline Aquahog

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 401
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2014, 06:16:46 PM »
Copplestone castings have beautiful 10mm Orc archers. As for Warmaster I'd assume they had to pick some 'core' units for each army to keep it manageable. Dwarfs didn't get miners and Empire didn't get Swordsmen e.g.

Offline Geep

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 900
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2014, 02:18:41 AM »
Quote
Seriously though if every army had the same thing, where is the flavour?
I agree, although many units in Warmaster have identical equivalents in other lists. The differences come from the Ld of the race and what's around to support them.
Although I plan to make Orc Arrer Boyz, if they hit the field they'll count as regular orcs (Goblins seems too shameful, despite the shooting attack). It's just nice to have variety in looks (and I am mad and want to recreate my entire Fantasy army in Warmaster scale).

Offline ruiza97

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 106
    • Loc: Dallas
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2014, 10:40:21 PM »
Make an Orc only list.

Offline Lex

  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1451
  • I wonder...
    • Loc: Bergen op Zoom, Netherlands
    • Warmuster . BitzBox
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2014, 07:58:08 AM »
Make an Orc only list.

What he says !!  Alternatively, run the O&G as a proxy-Bret army.....

Offline Ole

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 186
  • TTT
    • Loc: Hamburg
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2014, 10:01:38 AM »
Make an Orc only list.

What he says !!  Alternatively, run the O&G as a proxy-Bret army.....

That Idea is just great! You can even use savage orc boar boys as grail knight!

But our princess is in another castle!

Offline Lex

  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1451
  • I wonder...
    • Loc: Bergen op Zoom, Netherlands
    • Warmuster . BitzBox
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2014, 10:21:38 AM »
Make an Orc only list.

What he says !!  Alternatively, run the O&G as a proxy-Bret army.....

That Idea is just great! You can even use savage orc boar boys as grail knight!

Yup.. that is the idea....

Gobs --> peasants
and Orcs on Wyvern can pretend to be pegariders

And a nice Idol of Mork or Gork as reliquary

Offline jchaos79

  • Moderator
  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 2530
    • Loc: Vigo, Galicia, Spain
    • Fortunes of war
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2014, 11:20:05 AM »
 8)

Offline honestmistake

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 131
  • Tentacles make everything better!
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2014, 01:06:45 PM »
I prefer to proxy them as Albion. Swamp Orcs for the win  :)

Offline David Wasilewski

  • Warmasterplaytest team
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 700
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2014, 03:59:42 PM »
This is fantasy. ANYTHING can happen (as long as your opponent is happy).

Dave

Offline ruiza97

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 106
    • Loc: Dallas
Re: Why no archer units?
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2014, 10:17:33 PM »

What he says !!  Alternatively, run the O&G as a proxy-Bret army.....

That Idea is just great! You can even use savage orc boar boys as grail knight!

Yup.. that is the idea....

Gobs --> peasants
and Orcs on Wyvern can pretend to be pegariders

And a nice Idol of Mork or Gork as reliquary

Everything sounded great up to the savage Orc Boar riders, cause, you know, I don't have any savage Orc boar riders.