August 08, 2024, 12:26:47 AM

Author Topic: Blackstone vs Ramilies  (Read 5024 times)

Offline Trickstick

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 45
  • The Last Airship Pirate
Blackstone vs Ramilies
« on: March 07, 2012, 03:04:03 AM »
I recently read the rules for the "super mega-death shot" that the blackstone fortress has in the googledocs "Powers of chaos" file. I had a couple of questions about it.

1: Would it kill a Ramilies class star fort in a single shot, or would it just kill one section of it? I'm guessing it would just obliterate it but this has me worried, as the Ramilies has no way to avoid such a shot and would basically be dead meat in any engagement.

2: Can you stop the shot by crippling the blackstone whilst it is charging? I know you can't start charging whilst crippled but I may be incorrectly assuming that crippling it stops the process. This is the only way I can see to save my fortress.
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." - Hanlon's Razor

Offline Tyberius

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 61
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2012, 06:41:47 AM »
A Ramillies can only be destroyed if all quadrants are destroyed..

Offline Zhukov

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 261
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2012, 08:04:33 PM »

Would the beam have the same result on a Star Fort as it would a planet? One could argue a Star Fort probably is a bit more resilient and stable than a planet being hit.

My vote goes to the beam destroys one section of the fort entirely. If for nothing else, it does create game balance than a one shot kills 875 points of fort immediately.

-Zhukov
I am Zukov's Klaw.

"Oh mah gawd its like a giant veil was just lifted off my face and the beautiful maiden before my eyes just turned into a hideous Ork with a giant, bloody choppa."

Offline Brethren

  • Active Member
  • *
  • Posts: 74
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2012, 04:42:08 PM »
Would the beam have the same result on a Star Fort as it would a planet? One could argue a Star Fort probably is a bit more resilient and stable than a planet being hit.

My vote goes to the beam destroys one section of the fort entirely. If for nothing else, it does create game balance than a one shot kills 875 points of fort immediately.

-Zhukov

Hello,

I'm the new guy. :) Usually, I'm the type that reads forums, but rarely posts something. But since I found my way back to BFG, it's hard to resist.  ;)

My opinion:
  • Neither the Blackstone, nor the Ramilies are meant to be 'balanced'. They're great scenario-based 'specials', though. I don't expect to see them in every day battles.
  • For the idea of having a thrilling special-scenario, I'd say the 'super-mega death shot' should destroy an entire Ramilies since it only has one 'stem'. Maybe the Ramilies' armour has a stronger density than a planets surface... but it's not kilometers thick. And hey, it's a warp weapon (and normally hits like a lance). It doesn't care for armour at all.  ;)
  • 3rd, for the same reason as above, I'd say that crippling a Blackstone Fortress would abort the charging process.
One can argue about this, but given that the rules of the Blackstone Fortress it shouldn't be that difficult to interrupt. Staying still for 2 entire turns, no turrets and no 'brace for impact' makes it quite vulnerable to torpedoes and other ordnance. Additionally it counts as 'defence' so it's a nice target for every weapon battery out there. Add a nova cannon and you've a good chance of saving your Ramilies.
So, just give it a try... and change things afterwards, if you don't like it.

So long,

Brethren

Offline Jimmy Zimms

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 421
  • Beshert is Beshert
    • Loc: World Traveler
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2012, 06:08:33 PM »
  • Neither the Blackstone, nor the Ramilies are meant to be 'balanced'. They're great scenario-based 'specials', though. I don't expect to see them in every day battles.

Agreed. Anyone that shows up for a fleet engagement with either one as part of their "fleet" is a douche waffle and not going to get a game from me. Smells of rules gaming entirely (like the old Eldar carrier fleet of Doom, anyone?). They are completely meant for a specific scenario, not some standup and fight pick up game.[/list]
As we Imperials say, "The Emperor [class battleship] Protects..."

Offline AndrewChristlieb

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1651
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2012, 07:09:00 PM »
Idk that seems a bit harsh to m. Its hard enough for some people to find a game so Id still play with them. Just change the scenario to something more appropriate if you feel its too overpowered. 
I don't make the rules, I just think them up and write them down.

Offline Jimmy Zimms

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 421
  • Beshert is Beshert
    • Loc: World Traveler
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2012, 08:14:35 PM »
Oh sorry, is my misanthropy showing?  >:(
heh
As we Imperials say, "The Emperor [class battleship] Protects..."

Offline horizon

  • Moderator
  • Veteran member
  • *
  • Posts: 4197
  • Destiny Infinity Eternity
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2012, 08:45:20 PM »
I battle everythign encounter. The things are in the rules so they may be used. And it isn't even powergaming like the all Nightshade fleet or all Terror Kroozer fleets.

Offline Jimmy Zimms

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 421
  • Beshert is Beshert
    • Loc: World Traveler
Re: Blackstone vs Ramilies
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2012, 12:22:52 AM »
I battle everythign encounter. The things are in the rules so they may be used. And it isn't even powergaming like the all Nightshade fleet or all Terror Kroozer fleets.

I dig your willingness to game, man, I really do. I'm pointing out personal preference for gamers as this is the type of thing I use as a litmus test to gauge what type of player someone probably is. I usually immediately counter for exterminatus or other scenario than fleet engagement before I totally write them off-that's where things like this belong IMO (other too - see below). Perhaps I am just showing my grumpy old man syndrome but it's usually some young 15 year old apocalypse player "slumming" it in some BFG I see try this, hence my "douche-waffle" statement :) I get little enough play time/painting as a poppa to waste!

I'm going to quote BFG Armada on using the Planet Killer (replace the use of planet killer with Star Fort/Blackstone and I think it reads in the same spirit)
[emphasis mine]

Quote
INCLUDING THE PLANET KILLER
IN OTHER BATTLES
The Planet Killer isn’t particularly suited to
general fleet engagements
and is much more
appropriate for special scenarios or certain
types of games
. In fact, the Planet Killer is
very likely to be the whole reason for a
battle. For example, you could play Scenario
three: The Raiders, with the Chaos fleet
defending the Planet Killer. Instead of the
normal victory conditions, the attacking
player must cripple or destroy the Planet
Killer.
Another variation on the ‘destroy the Planet
Killer’ scenario is to use Surprise Attack.
Rather than orbiting a world, the defending
Chaos fleet is stationed around the Planet
Killer (perhaps it is undergoing repairs or
something similar). The defender does not
have to pay any points for the Planet Killer,
but it starts the battle on standby like the
other defending vessels. As such it cannot
move or shoot until active,  though turrets
and shields work as normal. The attackers
must cripple the Planet Killer to win.
Similarly, you could fight a Convoy
scenario, with the Planet Killer counting as
eight transports. The Planet Killer’s
unwieldy size will make it difficult to
manoeuvre in the dense celestial
phenomena, offsetting its far greater
offensive capabilities. If the Planet Killer
moves off the opposite table edge
undamaged then the Chaos player wins. If it
is crippled before it escapes it is a marginal
attacker win and if it is destroyed the
attacker gains a major win
« Last Edit: May 25, 2012, 12:24:27 AM by Jimmy Zimms »
As we Imperials say, "The Emperor [class battleship] Protects..."