Nate's Ork Clanz Rulez

[Sigoroth]

Anyone else think the fleet list is way too convoluted? The rules encourage using clan rules, large skwadrons, buying extra re-rolls and using upgrades, but the fleet list does the reverse.

For example, let's say you want one big special ship full of much orky goodness in a 1k fleet list. Let's say a boarding, ramming juggernaut that will also supply the fleets' AC quotient. Something like:

Warlord +2RR - 40 pts
Gorbag's Revenge - 310 pts
 - Goff Clan upgrade - 20 pts
 - Klaws - 10 pts
 - Ram Prow - 10 pts
 - Mega-armoured Boarding Parties - 15 pts
 - Soopa Boostas - 25 pts

This is a pretty nice ship, having an average of 7AC & 5 torps, ability to steal a kroozers' leadership (with 3 re-rolls), +2Ld when ramming, 25cm speed, auto AAF (4d6cm), grabbing klaws and power ram, and a +3~5 on boarding actions (orks, Goff, MABP & Warlord).

This ship will on average destroy a healthy (abeam) unbraced battleship in one turn through ramming and boarding, suffering only 1 hit in return. With a large base, auto AAF (25+4d6) and usually testing to ram against Ld 10 it's fairly easy to get off a ram. When ramming a BB the two large bases greatly increase the chance of remaining in contact for boarding and the likelihood of this is furthered by the 1 in 4 chance of grabbing on with both klaws.

So a really nice and Orky ship. However, to get that many upgrades you need to buy 2 re-rolls. That means you need another 5 skwadrons, at least 3 of which have to be escorts. On top of that you need 2 other capital ships. So the minimum needed to get this ship is 2 skwadrons of lite kroozers (180 pts) and 3 skwadrons of 3 Brute ramships (225 pts). This gives us a total of 835 pts. But we have to have another Warlord, which means another 2 skwadrons. The minimum is 2 times 3 Brutes, for another 150 pts. This makes a total of 985 pts, leaving just 15 pts. At best this will allow us to exchange a skwadron of Brutes for Grunts or Savages.

So one sooped up ship, 2 lite kroozers and 5 skwadrons of 3 escorts. All escort skwadrons minimum sized so no massive 10 escort packs running around, no "mob rule" and no taking advantage of fixed price skwadron upgrades and clan rules. Also no Terror ships or Kill Kroozers.

The basic problem seems to be that for each 500 pts extra that the fleet is worth you must spend at least 150 pts of it on the Warlords (really un-orky) retinue leaving only 350 pts to ork up your other warlords retinues.

Perhaps it should just be a minimum of 1 skwadron per RR. Or at least allow the smaller skwadrons to mob up or something.

[horizon]

To be honest I have never bothered reading the Ork document, I am no Ork expert.

But the way you write it I'll just stick to the gothic list for Orks.

[Sigoroth]

Yeah, it's really restrictive. Some of the rules are pretty good. The flat rate cost of upgrades and klan rulez for the escort skwadrons is a good idea and encourages large skwadron sizes. The Young Gunz and Mob Rule ideas are also pretty good. You can roll a 6 Ld on your Warboss's big ship, and get an 8 on your escorts Ld. Using your Warboss's dragooning ability you can then swap the leaderships, granting a free escort to your squadron. If you then have more than 5 escorts you get +1 Ld for the skwadron (so Ld 7, which isn't too bad). Then you could give a clan upgrade such as Evil Sunz (+5cm speed) for +20 pts for the entire skwadron, which is pretty good if you've got 9 ships (only buy 9 so you've got room for the free one). If you've got a Warlord in the skwadron then you could add on Soopa Boostas for another 25 pts. So for a total of 5 pts per ship you get +10cm speed and +2d6cm on AAF. Great for a Brute skwadron.

However, the requirement to take X number of skwadrons per re-roll really undermines all that effort to build character. The intention seems to be fairly clear. The restrictions try to build a retinue for each Warlord as well as limit the amount of cheap re-rolls an Ork fleet can take. This seems fine in theory, but in practice is way too complicated. Perhaps saying the Warlord needs 3 escorts per re-roll would be better than saying one skwadron of 3 per re-roll. This way you could build the large escort skwadrons encouraged by the rules. So if you had 3 Re-rolls you'd need 9 escorts (which you could skwadron as you please) and 3 other skwadrons.

[horizon]

Your idea at the end is good.

[TheMaster42]

The list is completely uncompetitive.  It has a lot of cool fluff ideas, but doesn't let you use any of it effectively.

[Sigoroth]

I also think it should be 1 Warlord per 750 pts or part, not 1 per 500.

[horizon]

// Is it true that any Ork Clanz fleet can only taken 1-2 kroozers? In any game size?
This is what it says:

BIG SHIP SKWADRON
1-2 Kroozers, chosen from the following list:

Or is this per Warlord?

[Sigoroth]

// Is it true that any Ork Clanz fleet can only taken 1-2 kroozers? In any game size?
This is what it says:

BIG SHIP SKWADRON
1-2 Kroozers, chosen from the following list:

Or is this per Warlord?

No, that is the options for squadron size. So you can't have a squadron of 4 Terror Ships for example. You must take 1 tiddla skwadron and 1 other skwadron for each re-roll an Ork Warlord has. This is both a minimum and a maximum. So if your Warlord had 3 re-rolls he could take upto 3 skwadrons of 1 or 2 Big Ships (Terror Ship, Kill Kroozer and/or Lite Kroozer) as well as 3 tiddla skwadrons. Alternatively he could take skwadrons of Roks or more tiddla skwadrons or an 'Uge Ship, so long as he has the right number of skwadrons.

[horizon]

Jeez... okay. Makes more sense but ... jeez. How difficult is it to write a fleet list?

[horizon]

Yesterday we played a blockade run.

Me the Imperial Navy (750) vs Ork clanz (1500)

Mainly as a try out for Clanz, and let me tell you, big clanz squadrons backed up by a Hulk is a really cool thing for Orks. Even wihout a Hulk and regular Terror the big squads are great.

Ork Ravagers, 6 of em backed up by some brutes (he likes mixing squadrons in Ork fashion), with looted torpedoes is effective. His average size for a torp marker per ship was about 5. So per turn they dished out ~30torpedoes. For ~300pts squadron. Nice. The re-roll is great.

Ork Leadership was per average higher then my IN leadership.

In the end my Dictator made it, I failed to cripple an escort squadron, big squads are nasty in scenarios like this.
One Lunar got unlucky as my BFI rolls where pretty poor with this one (failing every single BFI roll on this ship), where as the Dictator saved 6 BFI's with 6 rolls (4 lances from hulk hit, 4 saved). Average.

Other Lunar failed every single Ld check except the first. No BFI, no disengage. Then having 12 escorts in your rear does the trick.

Fun battle. I failed but getting the Dictator there was rewarding, I had two hits left, I receive 2 hits from last torpedo salvo and brace both. fewiee...


In a normal game perhaps things would be differently due the IN having more guns, now I just had to little to make a decent impact. (Dictator, 2x Lunar, 2x Sword, 3x Cobra).

He had Hulk, Terror, and a whole mix of escorts.