BFG:R Vote 1: Tyrant Stats

[Talos]

It's sort of against what were doing, I know, with ships only and all... but BFG:R puts a cap of one NC/fraction of 500 points. Thus 2 in 750pt game max, 3 in 1500pts, 4 in 2000pts, ect...

With that cap in place, NC spam is not even a thing. We could consider that implementation on NC's, or just on the dominator if you guys really hate the fact that it is rare in ONE out of FOUR segmentums . One would think the Gothic would be a bit rarer out of the GOTHIC sector, but you know...

Just smile, no offense intented by these pointed comments

[horizon]

What Sig creates is in fact a Dominator for 200pts with the NC option.
And makes the Dominator a 190NC option, with the Tyrant the torpedo variant.
Thus why a NC on the Tyrant?

Because it provides another option for fleets that cannot take a Dominator to take it put pay the extra points for it.

But with the reasonable reserve rules the Dominator is quite easily added. Plus the Lunar, Mars, Armageddon all have NC options.

[afterimagedan]

What Sig creates is in fact a Dominator for 200pts with the NC option.
And makes the Dominator a 190NC option, with the Tyrant the torpedo variant.
Thus why a NC on the Tyrant?

Because it provides another option for fleets that cannot take a Dominator to take it put pay the extra points for it.

But with the reasonable reserve rules the Dominator is quite easily added. Plus the Lunar, Mars, Armageddon all have NC options.

Armageddons and Mars are battlecruisers and fit in a different category. As far as the Lunars, if the Lunar is able to take NCs, why not the Tyrant?  I suppose the reason is because they can basically end up being the same ship as the Dominator?

[horizon]

Yeah, it wouldn't make sense in the end I think if you have a 200pts Tyrant which would be the carbon copy of a 190pts Dominator.

What about my idea?

[afterimagedan]

I don't see why it "wouldn't make sense." Honestly, I just like taking the Tyrant with 12wb at 30cm with torps. NC option isn't all that important to me.

[Talos]

Pretty much my only problem is the identical configuration thing. The tyrant not having a NC just reinforces it's flavor in my book and helps give the 2 vessels as having their own distinct roles to play.

@ horizon Sigoroth's idea is fine and fills a much needed niche in IN, but your suggestion is both very flavorful (fits established fluff that tyrant has long range plasma batteries standard) and useful (being only extended range cruiser in IN fleet).

[AndrewChristlieb]

The Gothic is actually the second most common of all Imperial capitol ships after the Lunar and like wise can be built in almost any conditions. The Dominator however requires quite a bit more extensive facilities to construct and are very limited in output. Whit the relative rarity of the Nova cannon and its shells its no wonder that these are so few in number. As for the other varients how about limiting them to Gothic sector lists? That would support the fluff stating that only after having been proven during the Gothic war did some ships undergo the refit from Torpedoes to Nova. There is nothing i have read that would indicate that any ships other than Dominators, Mars, and Apocs were built with Novas. It could be argued that as the Armageddons are typically rebuilt Lunars that the option to carry a Nova should be even stricter for them as it would have to be based off of a Lunar that happened to also have undergone a refit to carry a Nova cannon :/.

[Talos]

Problem is once again you are thinking too small in scope; this is less of "history of the gothic war" an more of "epic space battles in the dark millenium". Like I stated, dominator is quite common in other fleets; it is a war ship through and through. As for gothic, it is known to be quite common, and yet is considered very difficult to construct according to RT anyway due to the fact that several components have to be of superb craftsmanship to allow it to fire such an energy intensive weapon loadout.

[horizon]

It is only common on the Eastern Fringe/Kar Duniash fleet.

Fleet Doctrine also plays part, not only construction.

[Talos]

Eastern fringe of the Ultima Segmentum is the biggest one in the imperium, so stands to reason that accounts for a fair bit of ships?

@ horizon Not sure if I am understanding you correctly on differenciation between doctrine/construction; I presume you mean most fleets have a distinctive combat style of sorts, many of which preclude long range fire support and preliminary bombardments. This is true. I am merely stating that the dominator could easily be more available than it is, without destroying the game or crapping on established fluff. If we were to have a dozen or two fleet lists, we could remove it from half other and restrict it for the other quarter...wait a sec, that would be an interesting fluff dive for fleet division (when we get to it): 4 lists, 1 per segmentum.

On topic, I guess the NC option can stay if people insist; no one is forcing me to take it, after all . But especially if we revisit the NC, we can afford to relax the leash a little on the dominator eventually. 

[horizon]

Relax the leash.. but but... the NC must be better! 

[Talos]

I completely agree with you; NC spam is like any other spam; unsportsmanlike like abuse of a game mechanic. But the NC is 20pts on average more than a torpedo and generally weaker other than its excellent range. I like the BFG:R touch of being able to use lock on to reroll scatter, but unfortunately horizon of my heart we will have to wait until the rules document to cross that bridge...and then have it Nova cannon'd.

EDIT: I think I'm going to have to retcon that last phrase into horizon ole pal instead, to avoid any confusing and ultimately sexuality based questions.

[AndrewChristlieb]

So... keepin it simple Nova option yay or nay?

[afterimagedan]

Everyone go to the new thread and let's vote.