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Author Topic: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships  (Read 3481 times)

Offline Armiger84

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Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« on: May 19, 2013, 01:28:59 AM »
Ok, first off, this is about as ALPHA-stage as it can get.

So, we have the "Punisher" class cruiser in the Additional Ships Compendium... but I don't like it, mostly because it's got too much going on, and feels like an Adeptus Astartes strike cruiser on steroids.  Conceptually, what I'm looking to create here are one or more light cruisers who wouldn't necessarily be standard fleet assets, but possibly something you could include for fun in a larger fleet action centered around a planet.

So, while I was waiting for my basecoat to dry on the Blasphemer-class, I went leafing through my copy of Matthew Farrer's Enforcer and my Dark Heresy Book of Judgment for inspiration.  In terms of background or general rules, I'd offer the following.  Adeptus Arbites ships should either come out of a Planetary Defenses points allotment, or if bought as part of a fleet should not count toward the requirements for CBs, CGs, or BBs as the Adeptus Arbites are fully outside the Imperial Naval hierarchy and operate separately (furthermore, are only able to squadron with other Adeptus Arbites vessels).  I don't think they should be able to take secondary commanders from their "parent" fleet, nor should they really get an admiral-level commander of their own unless you're doing a custom scenario anyhow, IMO.

So, the Adeptus Arbites are by nature primarily a dirt-side force, but they do maintain small fleets of patrol boats and monitors for anti-piracy and customs work (getting a lot of this from Enforcer).  Each Arbites cruiser is essentially a space-going Precinct House, complete with holding cells, at least one circuit-riding Judge, Verispex officers for investigations, and of course, a full complement of Arbites troopers trained not only in riot control but also in boarding actions.  There's an excellent sequence in Crossfire (the first book of the Enforcer trilogy) where an Arbites Indictor-class Fast Cruiser's troops complement storms an Ecclesiarchy pilgrim transport.  We don't get to see much of the Indictor's actual armament (at all), sadly, but the name alone conjures up images of a nimble light cruiser used for pursuit and capture missions.

So, I'm playing around with the Smotherman v205 document, at least to get myself started.

Arbites Indictor-class Fast Cruiser

Type/Hits:  Cruiser/4
Speed:  25cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  1
Armor:  5+
Turrets:  1

Port Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Left
Stbd. Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Right
Prow Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 2 - L/F/R

Special Rules:  Improved Thrusters (+1D6 AAF); Arbites Precinct House - gets +1 to its dice roll when defending against boarding actions.

So, adding things up, it would be 20 points for the hull, +5 points for the speed, +10 for the shield, +10 for the hull, +5 for the turret, +12 for the port/stbd batteries, +3 for the prow batteries, +10 for the improved thrusters, and I'm going to add +5 points in for the Voss-pattern defensive bonus, for a total of 80pts.  I have -NO- idea how to properly value the defensive bonus, so totally let me know if that's off.

My thinking:  This is basically a weaker, cheaper Siluria, mostly because I (a) didn't want to simply port the Siluria over and buff it, (b) like the idea of adding some even smaller light cruisers to the game, and Arbites patrol ships seemed like a good place to do that, and (c) I don't want the kind of crazy power creep for these guys that the Punisher-class has.  They're customs cops who primarily deal with escort-level transports and pirate raiders, so they really don't need SERIOUSLY STRONG cruiser-level stuff.

The other idea I had was, well, I'll be honest, a slightly modified Defiant-class:

Arbites Sentencer-class Customs Cruiser

Type/Hits:  Cruiser/6
Speed:  25cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  1
Armor:  5+
Turrets:  2

Port Launch Bays - 30cm - Str 1 (Fighters & Assault Boats) - N/A
Stbd. Launch Bays - 30cm - Str 1 (Fighters & Assault Boats) - N/A
Prow Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - L/F/R

Special Rules:  Arbites Precinct House - gets +1 to its dice roll when defending against boarding actions.

So, since I'm pretty much porting the Defiant over, I figure 110 points would be acceptable hopefully.  My big modifications are twofold:  torpedoes are a naval weapon and these guys really only need defensive batteries, and I don't see the Arbites using bombers but I do see them possibly using something like a light ketch to perform longer-distance ship inspections, so that could translate over to assault boats pretty easily (and I figure trading out bombers for assault boats is an acceptable 1:1 trade?).  My thinking is, this ship class would be 0-1, or maybe you must take 2-3 Indictors to unlock 1 Sentencer.

I did think about trying to combine the two cruiser styles, but every time I did, I basically ended up with something very similar to the Punisher that had simply too many little toys built in to be effective at any one role, and for that matter, fielding more than one Arbites cruiser would have meant generating a significant amount of extra attack craft for an Imperial allied fleet.  I'd rather have a couple of Indictor-class gunships and maybe a single Sentencer-class if an engagement was really big enough to warrant it (otherwise, these are really meant for special scenarios, or for an alternative approach to a convoy or pirate base raid).

Why a light carrier?  I figure it's moderately fitting the lore for them to have extremely limited carrier assets to help them police larger ports (sending out small customs boats to run inspections while stuff's still on its way in from the transition point), and they might keep some limited interceptors onboard as well to handle torpedo-armed pirate raiders.  My thinking is, a big Sector capital like Port Maw would only have maybe one or two Sentencers and a handful of Indictors, backed up by perhaps a squadron or two of escorts similar to Defense Monitors, and really most of the cruiser assets would probably be "riding circuit" throughout the Sector, bringing Judges to far-flung worlds that don't have their own Arbites Precincts, or tasked out to provide coverage for smaller mercantile ports in other systems on a rotating basis anyhow.

If I were to add any other rules, I'd say Arbites ships should use the Imperial Navy Leadership Chart for rolling ship leadership rather than going with the standard Defense Ld 7 (and possibly this too for Arbites-controlled Defense Monitors, although I don't like the idea of giving the Arbites lances at all and the Navy probably wouldn't either), and since they're professional riot cops, should they get the +1 boarding modifier like Orks and Chaos?  I'm just thinking of squads of riot shield & shock maul guys storming a hull breach, backed up by ranks of shotgun troops and boltgun-armed sharpshooters and grenade launchers, with grapplehawks and cyber-mastiffs charging breaking up organized defenses... these aren't exactly press-ganged naval ratings!


Questions?  Comments?  Suggestions?  Improvements?
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2013, 04:53:30 AM »
Majority of the ships are going to be fast and light, to respond quickly to internal strife around the galaxy. A hive world has severe civil uprising for instance. Though maybe one class of heavy monitor wouldn't be bad.

I actually like the concept of the Punisher and feel it would be fine if it just lost its launch bays. Fighters don't make that much sense anyways. I would say keep it around as it is established fluff. Just take the LB off. Maybe make the punisher strictly more of an orbital strike platform with it's bombardment cannons.

The ships you have seems good.

Some sort of prison ship is in order. And obviously light pirate hunting escorts.

Judgement Class Heavy Monitor- 180
Type/Hits:  Cruiser/4
Speed:  10cm
Turns:  45*
Shields:  3
Armor:  6+
Turrets:  3

Port Weapons Battery - 45cm - Str 8 - Left
Stbd. Weapons Battery - 45cm - Str 8 - Right
Dorsal Lance Battery - 45cm - Str 2 - L/F/R

Cannot use come to new heading. AAF is 2D6 rather than 4D6.

Punisher Class Strike Cruiser- 170
Type/Hits:  Cruiser/6
Speed:  25cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  2
Armor:  6+/5+ rear
Turrets:  2

Port Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Left
Stbd. Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Right
Dorsal Bombardment Cannons - 30cm - Str 4 - L/F/R
Prow Torpedoes- 30cm- Str 6 - Front
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Offline AndrewChristlieb

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2013, 05:43:11 AM »
Cool. This I really like:

Quote
Arbites Indictor-class Fast Cruiser

Type/Hits:  Cruiser/4
Speed:  25cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  1
Armor:  5+
Turrets:  1

Port Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Left
Stbd. Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - Right
Prow Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 2 - L/F/R

Special Rules:  Improved Thrusters (+1D6 AAF); Arbites Precinct House - gets +1 to its dice roll when defending against boarding actions.

Couple things: First Id bump it up to 30cm speed, this would be fitting given its size and role. Second I would go ahead and do the +1 in boarding instead of just the +1 when defending. 80 points seems pretty reasonable for this. I would still leave it as a standard defense for leadership purposes, with the ability to take special orders (which all defenses should be able to take anyway ::)) I just don't see them being any better in a fleet level action than a defense platform or station.

 
Quote
Arbites Sentencer-class Customs Cruiser

Type/Hits:  Cruiser/6
Speed:  25cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  1
Armor:  5+
Turrets:  2

Port Launch Bays - 30cm - Str 1 (Fighters & Assault Boats) - N/A
Stbd. Launch Bays - 30cm - Str 1 (Fighters & Assault Boats) - N/A
Prow Weapons Battery - 30cm - Str 4 - L/F/R

Special Rules:  Arbites Precinct House - gets +1 to its dice roll when defending against boarding actions.

This is ok, its very much like the Enforcer. I would probably drop the hits back to 4 on this, 30cm speed, +1d6 AAF, +1 boarding, and keep the prow weapons the same. Basically a variant of the other ship. With that in mind and the Indictor at 80 points +5 for the extra turret and maybe +15 for swapping the launch bays Id price it around ~100 points. Id also remove any restriction on this but I also wouldn't see these outside of a defense purchase.
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Offline afterimagedan

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2013, 06:47:16 AM »
This is sweet stuff! Can't wait to see how it goes.

Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2013, 11:46:14 PM »
Maybe something for BFG:R?
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Offline Armiger84

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2013, 01:45:00 AM »
Question for the Mods:  does this thread more properly belong over in the Experimental Rules section?  (and if so, feel free to move it)

I'm actually kinda surprised nobody seemed to even blink at the suggestion of "Imperial" 4-hit light cruisers.  Then again, I'm playing around with a pair of ships meant for a limited selection of scenarios and which I'd tentatively suggested would come out of a defenses budget.

My problem with the Punisher, however semi-official it might be, is its loadout.  It's a 6-point light cruiser with 25cm movement AND an armor 6 prow, more bombardment cannons than a Space Marine strike cruiser AND a full torpedo spread on top of that (let's just pretend that 2 points of hangar bays are two points of hangar bays wherever they're mounted).  It's a pimped-out warship, not a light patrol cruiser meant for intra-system commerce surveillance rather than fleet actions (which is what it looks like it's built for).  Again, personal interpretation of game lore, but if the Imperial Navy gets twitchy about the Adeptus Astartes having lance boats, I can't imagine them being comfortable with the federal police force zooming around in planetary assault cruisers that outgun just about everything in their displacement class.  Anyhow.

I like 25cm and Improved Thrusters for the Indictor rather than upping it to 30cm, mostly because the fastest any cruisers in the Imperial Fleet get is 25cm, and while this ship might not be able to run down an Iconoclast, it'll wreck the destroyer while it's fleeing, and 25cm +5D6 AAF is more than enough to catch a runaway freighter and the Chaos Heavy Raiders (Infidel, Idolator, heck, Havoc too).

If I tried to chop down the Sentencer to a 4-hit cruiser, it'll Smotherman out to about 90 points (20 for hit points, 10 for the shield, 10 for two turrets, 10 for the 5+ hull, 5 for the speed (25cm), 27 for the hangars, 6 for the str 4 30cm L/F/R guns, so round it up to 90).

This would make it far and away the cheapest carrier available to an Imperial fleet, even if all it can generate is 2 fighters or 2 assault boats, and it's pretty fast and maneuverable on top of that.  That said, if I go with AndrewChristlieb's suggestion of enforcing Defense Ld 7 on the ships, you're not looking at a lot of attack craft from it, and I'm thinking I like my "must take 2 Indictors for every 1 Sentencer" requirement, which would limit its appearance to either a pure Arbites fleet mini-scenario, or to a bigger game where someone could afford to Reserve in a number of ships or buy a lot of Planetary Defenses... so maybe that's not that much of an issue.

Now, not that I was really planning on expanding the Arbites out into a complete fleet, but what about an intra-system patrol corvette?

Adeptus Arbites Vigilant-class Corvette

Type/Hits:  Escort/1
Speed:  30cm
Turns:  90*
Shields:  1
Armor:  5+
Turrets:  2

Weapons Battery:  30cm str 3 L/F/R
Special Rules:  Vigilant-class Corvettes mount long-range detection gear.  This doubles the Leadership test bonus for enemy contacts (i.e., enemy on special orders) from +1 to +2.

Vigilant-class Corvettes are a Sword-class Frigate adaptation unique to the Adeptus Arbites.  A portion of the Vigilant's laser batteries have been stripped out to make room for a long-range detection array.  Furthermore, the Vigilant's power plants runs redlined, eking out a little extra speed and maneuverability that proves crucial while on patrol, but statistically leads to a much greater degree of time drydocked for repairs and maintenance.  However, since Vigilants spend the vast majority of their time on intra-system patrol, this is not nearly as much of a problem as it would be for a Navy frigate.   Typically, Vigilants operate in pairs, scouring a system's asteroid belts or outermost reaches for pirate activity.  In larger operations by the Adeptus Arbites, Vigilants scout the way for the Indictors and Sentencers, using their enhanced sensor suites to locate pirate wolf packs and relay their positions back to the heavier cruisers.

Costing this out it would be roughly 6 for the speed, 5 for the hull point, 5 for the shield, 5 for the armor, 10 for the turrets, 4.5 for the weapons, and based on the Cobra entry, 1.5 for the funky detection gear so 37, round it either up to 40 or down to 35, but I'm comfortable with going up to 40 since it's a moderately buffed Sword.  If I were to model one of these up, I'd probably start with a Sword's body frame, add an extra pair of engines, chop down the prow to more of a 45* angle, and run a bunch of antennas out from under it to represent the active search gear.  as a fast gunboat with good leadership (at least once the shooting starts), these would make decent escorts or a flanking squadron for playing tag with an escort-heavy raiding fleet.  They're not going to out-gun anything, but they'll be pretty likely to succeed on a lock-on order and they'll be backed up by a couple of light cruisers at least, so they'll probably be less of an apparent threat, at least at first glance.

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 01:46:59 AM by Armiger84 »
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Offline afterimagedan

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2013, 03:09:41 AM »
I like it.  :D  Not too different that it would be considered extreme.

Offline Cervantes3773

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2013, 04:26:02 PM »
Any thoughts on using Arbites ships/stations as objectives, and worth more if Chaos/Renegade forces capture/destroy them?

I can see a scenario where the Arbites arrest a known seditionist only to have a pirate fleet attempt to rescue him.  Obviously, it wouldn't necessarily fit with Xenos fleets, but it's something to chew on.

Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2013, 02:05:05 PM »
Do you want to include these in the additional ships compendium two?
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Offline Armiger84

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Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2013, 03:35:14 PM »
I appreciate the enthusiasm, but my suggestions for a pair of Arbites hulls are barely a week old and as far as I know still not play tested (I certainly haven't yet), as such, I would be extremely uncomfortable making them a part of the Compendium (and thus gaining a veneer of quasi-officialness) just yet.

If I were to do anything with them, it would probably be an eventual Warp Rift Online "cops & robbers" style article for Adeptus Arbites against pirate wolf packs scenarios or something.
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Offline Gothmog Lord of Balrogs

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Re: Possible Adeptus Arbites Ships
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2013, 09:36:38 PM »
Sounds cool. Though maybe down the road in ASC 2.1... :)

I wish I could play test right now.
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